I'll spare little Bobbie a thought while I'm taking my gigantic post-Turkey-feast dump. The minute the bolide his the water, I'll think: "This one's for you, Bobbie!"

A Turd for a Turd on Turkey Day! It has a nice ring, Monty. I'll make a hefty deposit to his Turdy Day cause.

This guy must be a f@cking riot at Christmas

People that feel that bad need to just go ahead and kill themselves. One less imperialist.

Self flagellation! Do we get to self flagellate? A day of atonement without self-flagellation would be like turkey without cranberry sauce. Pass the turkey, please?

You know what I'm willing to do, in the spirit of atonement and self-sacrifice? One-ply only. No satin-soft two-ply bungwipe for me on Thanksgiving. With every painful horizontal scrape, I will be reminded of the depredations of the white man and be suitably ashamed.

"painful horizontal scrape"

You lying on your side?

If I wanted spiritualistic restrictions on my consumption I'd be, like, religious and stuff.

Conservatives are moralistic about sex. Liberals are moralistic about consumption and food.

And while we're contemplating the impending revelry and rejection of Jensen's glum moralizing, let me just say: "BURY DALLAS, BRONCOS!!"

Ironeyes Cody

I heard he wasn't Native-American.

in that idiotic Detroit-on-Thames accent of hers.

You mean she's not really British?

Ironeyes Cody: I heard he wasn't Native-American.

Quite true. From Wikipedia:

Iron Eyes Cody (April 3, 1904 – January 4, 1999) was an actor born in Kaplan, Louisiana. He was born Espera DeCorti, the son of Sicilian immigrants Francesca Salpietra and Antonio DeCorti. He was not born a Native American, but he claimed to be part Cherokee and part Cree. Cody and his wife Bertha Parker adopted children that were Native American. Cody began his acting career at the age of 12 and continued to work until the time of his death. In 1996, the New Orleans Times-Picayune exposed his true heritage, but Cody denied it.

Conservatives are moralistic about sex.

Haven't spent much time around here yet, have you?

let me just say: "BURY DALLAS, BRONCOS!!"

I feel that. But I think we probably have different agendas.

And while we're contemplating the impending revelry and rejection of Jensen's glum moralizing, let me just say: "BURY DALLAS, BRONCOS!!"

Damn, I missed that.

In your dreams, wild horse boy.

given the quality of play the Cowboys have shown this season, I'm hoping for the best and expecting the worst.

Friday's game will be much more enjoyable I'm sure. Hook em Horns.

That whole piece was fairly amazing, but I particularly liked Jensen's comment:

How does a country deal with the fact that some of its most revered historical figures had certain moral values and political views virtually identical to Nazis?

Friday's game will be much more enjoyable I'm sure. Hook em Horns.

And that I can agree on (spent 4 years in Austin when my dad taught AFROTC at UTexas).

Can I get an exemption because my family didn't get to this country until 1957?

If not, I can't promise to not have fun on Thanksgiving, but I promise to try and feel bad about it.

Which is all that matters, really.

I'm hoping for the best as well. Or for an entertaining game.

What, the tax free casinos that make billions a year weren't enough payback?

Repeating myself from elsewhere:

[I don't care about Indians anymore.]

I don't even blame Indians themselves for my not caring. I blame leftists like this "day of atonement" clown. I'm tired of them acting like the European migration into North America was any different than the Asiatic immigration into North America, like the Europeans somehow introduced violence into a pristine paradise.

I've heard people say -- seriously, to their children, as if they were imparting absolute facts -- that there was no war among the pre-Columbian tribes. My own father -- who grew up watching Gene Autry and whom I'd describe as bigoted in a lot of ways -- believes the British introduced scalping to North America. I won't even get into the idiocy of the "they lived in balance with nature" crap.

You want the truth? Look into the Crow Creek Massacre Site, Cahokia Mound 72, and Head-Smashed-In Buffalo Jump. Ask yourself what happened to human gene sets that existed in North America before the Asiatic migration, but disappeared shortly afterwards. Ask why settlements throughout the eastern US sprouted walls with bastions around 1300 AD.

And why is the need for atonement always focused on the US? The Spanish killed more people, with more speed, and tore apart two civilizations. The French were as bad as the English; they even destroyed the last remnant of the Mississippian cultures. Why not ride their asses for a while?

On the advice of this yahoo, I am very proud to say that for Thanksgiving dinner I and my family will indeed be abstaining from turkey.

But not "fasting", as such.

Instead we are having good old honest American ELK.

Just like my white ancestors would have eaten. Yummy yummy ELK. A magnificent and proud beast, especially with red wine and onions.

Call it our tribute to the spirit of atonement and sacrifice.

Fast away, loser.

Per Monty, after my big meal I'll sit on the john and "deconstruct" a big "thesis."

It will have the same smell, texture, and color as this prof's PhD.

If you'll pardon my being the devil's advocate for a moment, but Jensen does have a point, of sorts. If I were an Indian - excuse me, "Native American" - I'd probably be more than a little pissed off at having been elbowed out of land that had once been exclusively my people's. And there's no papering over horrors like the Trail of Tears.

It's been like this throughout history, of course: the strong dominate, and the weak go to the wall. If the Indians had had the technological advantage that the whites enjoyed, they'd have dealt with Columbus et al. the way that they'd dealt with the Norse 500 years earlier - by isolating their settlements and wiping them out.

However, there is not a whit of hypocrisy in my family's thanksgiving. My German and Irish ancestors came to this nation to find liberty - to worship God as they chose, to work and prosper without some perfumed nobleman blocking their path - and here they found it. For that, we will celebrate and give thanks, with hearts filled with gratitude for this nation's existence and the good fortune that brought us to it.

And if petty vindictive self-righteous ranting fools like Robert Jenson cannot accept that, they can kiss my ass.

None of my ancestors set foot on this continent before 1890. When folks in the Ukraine devote a day to feeling bad about their ancestors being mean to my ancestors, then I'll consider setting aside a day for feeling bad about what happened to people completely beyond my family's influence.

Then I'll remember that these people had thousands of years to develop in a resource wealthy region but failed to drag themselves much past the Stone Age in North America. They did a bit better in Central and South America but set themselves up for a fall by being so rapacious that every tribe not wiped out by disease was happy to join the Conquistadors in taking down the Empire. Rome, it was not.

Advanced races and nations expand. Aboriginal races and nations get hosed. Welcome to the real world.

Turkey with allll the trrrrrimmmings...
I will celebrate with my big Irish/Italian family the fact that immigrants had the intestinal fortitude to come to this land, and stick it out through the harshest of conditions, so that the rest of us could come here and make it AS AMERICANS.
Indians had it rough over history, but so did wave after wave of new arrivals. It is, however, history.
It is our America, 'indigenous people' included.
Turkey, ham, stuffing, home made deer/pork sausages, cold meats and bread, focaccia, beer and red wine (Sonoma County, baby!!) as well as grappa.
Sharks at 7pm west coast time.
Go Sharks!

I am going to spend the day giving thanks that I am not French.

Yes, yes, yes, it's all been said before ad nausem. Yawn, we all share the collective guilt of our ancestors even those of us who didn't have any ancestors involved in those alleged land stealing events.

I say to Robert Jensen and his ilk, get a life, you have no future if your existence is buried in yesterday.

My wife is a Native American (Pottowatamie) and she's cooking the turkey. Afterward, if I'm lucky, she'll let me occupy her land, if you know what I'm saying.

Invade her territory, I should have said. That would have been funny. D'oh.

The Pilgrims were just undocumented aliens looking for a better life for their families.

Either way works, Adolfo.

We would have also enjoyed She'll smoke the peace pipe.

We'll play hide-the-arrowhead.

Despoil that land, baby. Intrude on the solitude, make your inroads, erect a pump, drill the pristine territory and let 'er go until you've completely destabilized the surrounding environment.

Developing natural resources. Is there anything it can't do?

She'll guide me across the great mountains to the place of the sacred beaver.

Okay, I better stop before I get in trouble.

My wife is a Native American (Pottowatamie) . . .

So, she's from Michigan?

BTW, it's spelled Potawatomi. You should know this if you're planning to boink her.

BTW, it's spelled Potawatomi. You should know this if you're planning to boink her.
Posted by Michael at November 23, 2005 07:13 PM

I'm sorry, but they spell it six different ways down here. Who can keep up?

Down here, being Oklahoma.

OK, this comment thread took a bizarre turn.

Reminds me of one of the reasons I treasure this site.

You're a lucky man, Adolfo. Folks from the Oklahoma branch of the Potawatomi tribe are renowned for being extremely horny. Which is why they got kicked out of Michigan, by the way.

"People that feel that bad need to just go ahead and kill themselves."

Ah, but he feels very good when he's telling us how bad we are--that's probably his greatest pleasure in life. And in that role he is automatically absolved of any guilt. (But don't ask him about the many real leftist genocides of the twentieth century--or, for that matter, about all the horrible things done by supposedly pure, innocent, virtuous non-white non-western native peoples. He might choke to death on his tofu.)

The good professor should curl up on his couch with a good book, pull the smallpox-infected blanket the white man makes him use up over his head and STAY THE FUCK OUT OF OUR NATIONAL HOLIDAY! The day's supposed to be about GIVING THANKS, not BEING AN INSUFFERABLE ASSHAT.

I'm with Monty on this one, and I'll up the ante. After I finish my second helping of turkey, I'll suck down a can of Hormel Chili to ensure that my contribution to the "Perfessor Bob Turdpile" has the same consistency as his logic.

How would you like to be this guy's kids?
I can only imagine what Christmas is like at the Jensen household.

Timmy " Daddy, joey from next door gets gifts from Santa on Christmas..will Santa come tonight?"

Mr. Jensen "You want to talk about gifts and Santa!Think of all the people killed in the name of "christ". And your "santa kkklaus"? Nothing but a manufactured tool by jewish fatcat business interests to profit world capitalism!

Now go back and eat you unflavored tofu and read your Chomsky"

That guy must have been a real f'king hoot to hang around in college. I'll bet he was head of the football team's guilt-leading squad. Every time his team scored a touch down, they would wail and moan about how they were lowering the other teams' self-esteem and being unfair by hoarding all the points.

Ya know, I don't know who this Jensen guy is and I really don't care about his opinions. I plan to enjoy Thanksgiving without so much as wasting a passing thought about his little hang-ups.

You should see the comments on this idiot's blog. Some moonbat admits that he doesm';t observe July 4, Memorial Day, or Veterans Day. He homeschools his kid withe Zinns "People;s History of the U.S", a depressing tome if there ever was one.

The liberals will be last against the wall when the Revolution comes....

Its also instructive that this guy doesn't want to create a national Day of Atonement which is apart from everything else.

No, he wants to run it over an established holiday, change (ruin) what is already a pretty good day in America.

If he wants us to atone for things we never did*, then why does he have to use one of five major national holidays to do it?

There are 360 other days in the year, dickweed.

This just confirms again to me that what drives leftism is jaundiced malcontents who just feel the need to piss on others' happiness.

*Before anybody chimes in and says, yes we did kill Indians, I would like to point out that the people who did that shit are DEAD, and most of us came to this country a century or more after the deed was done.
So, no, WE didn't. If you are a descendant of those who did such, and want to flog yourself for something your great-great-great grandparents did, go ahead. But be aware that when someone commits a murder, we don't consider their descendants guilty of it for all time forward.

Unless you're a European, and you like bloody thousand-year feuds.

Which is what this all is. Creeping Europeanism. What my family came here to escape.

Once again; thanks alot, dickweed.

If we leave things up to these idiots, America will be like Greece and Bulgaria.

Laura, from the few years I was living by the Rez I can say there are still plenty of people killing Indians. For the most part, they're other Indians. Just as it always was.

But I guess that's OK. Because, you know, they're not Anglos.

Internet+wine makes things easy to misinterpret; took me a little time to get your sarcasm, there VRWC.

As a 1/8th blooded Slapaho and as a member of the reality-based, progressyve community, I must express my extreme disgust and displeasure at the following post, with is both offensive and vile.

Ask and you shall receive, Chef Bob.

In one Indian tribe the Chief that named the babies was getting on up in years. He had been naming the babies for so long that about 80% of the tribe had been named by him.

One day a soon-to-be brave came to The Naming Chief's lodge and asked to talk. The Chief invited him in and asked what was on his mind. The young man said, "You have been naming our people for many years. My father was named by you as were his brothers. Me and my brothers and perhaps hundreds more, yet no two have the same name.

How do you come up with these names?" The Naming Chief said, "I do not name these babies myself. They are named by the Great Spirit. You see, when a baby is about to be born, the other chiefs and the father of the child all gather in my lodge to smoke and consult with the Great Spirit. As soon as we receive word the baby has been born, I look out the flap of my lodge to see what the Great Spirit shows me. If he shows me snow gently falling, that baby's name is 'Snow Gently Falling', if he shows me a hawk in the sky, that baby's name is 'Hawk In The Sky'.

But tell me, why does this interest you, Two Dogs Fucking?"

Laura: No blood no foul. :-)

Bart, dare I say it? It's, er, at the age we should call it venerable.

Yea but has Chief Bob heard it yet?

I heard that joke when i was in grade school and it still make me laugh to this day.

I dunno why extreme leftism isn't more popular outside the academy--why, you get to fast and think on your sins on Thanksgiving, listen to bitter rants about angry vaginas on Valentine's Day, and spend Christmas shivering outside in the cold at an ACLU rally protesting the subtle oppression of the courthouse creche.

No food, no sex, no presents--and you don't even get to go to heaven at the end.

No food, no sex

Yes, but of they did have sex, it would be much more creative and fulfilling than the kind all those married right wingers have. It's all about the dream, man.

In the 70's it was suggested that America observe a National Humiliation Day to apologize for the Viet Nam war. Columnist Art Buchwald thought we shouldn't, pointing out that the merchants would immediately start running Humiliation Day sales.