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September 11, 2005
Bumped: Another "Inadvertant" Feature of Flight 93 Memorial: Crescent Points Towards Mecca (CONFIRMED, with Update)According to the Qibla finder, which goes according to the shortest route (in this case, over the North Pole), the midpoint of the "Cresent of Embrace" points directly towards Mecca, if you imagine an arrow nocked in the "bow" of the crescent.
Thanks to Aaron of Lifelike Pundits for that graphic. More Credit: I'm sorry, but I don't know who should properly be credited with the pic. Aaron of Lifelike Pundits sent it to me, but Politicalities credits it to "Etaoin Shrdlu," by way of "Zombie." Incidentally, Politicalities calculates the angle of the crescent mathematically and finds that the line bisecting its midpoint interesects with Mecca with an error smaller than 1/580th of the arc of a circle. A fair amount less than one degree.
Is the Marxist designer of this "memorial" going to tell us that's yet another inadvertant coincidence, based only on the fact that he finds this particular Mecca-pointing tilt of the crescent "aesthetically pleasing"? Edits: This post has been edited to remove my initial confusion and stupidity and caveats about this being unconfirmed and speculative. It is now quite confirmed. And I apologize to the reader who suggested the "great circle" route to Mecca, which I scoffed at. The Crescent Points to China, Not Mecca?: Nope, not according to that picture. The FAT PART of the crescent is not quite centered on the crescent; indeed, if you take the midpoint of the *fat part* of the crescent, that doesn't point to Mecca. Conceded. But the midpoint of the whole crescent, starting at one slender tip, ending at the other, does seem to point straight to Mecca. Coincidence? Or design? Okay, yes, it's quite possible this is a coincidence. But this guy's whole bio and his statements about his "art" suggest a lefty, and I'm just having trouble believing an architect dealing primarily in symbolism (the whole dealio is intended to be symbolic -- forty trees for forty victims, windchimes to symbolize the rings of their last phone calls, etc.) missed the symbolism of the crescent, and then just happened to accidentally point it towards Mecca to boot. What If A Known Right-Wing Architecht Had Done This?: I would suggest in that case the left, currently scoffing at this, would be having a fit, because they would read the monument and pointing the finger of blame at Mecca. And, just in case you're curious, I'd be against that too. It's inappropriate in a memorial to the dead to have any stealth political messaging going on. But Let's Assume... that this all is inadvertant and coincidental. The left wouldn't allow that a memorial was accidentally designed to suggest the shape of a cross; whether inadvertant or not, the symbolism is there. A lot of lefty po-mo deconstructionists deny the author's primacy in interpretation, and say that any reader can read any symbolism into a text he likes, pretty much. So even if the "author" of this memorial is telling the truth-- hey, that symbolism is still there. One reader points out, sagely, that a memorial should spark discussion about those being memorialized. Well, that being the case, this designer has failed miserably, because no one -- no one -- is talking about the courageous dead of Flight 93. Everyone's talking about that crescent. Coincidence or design, inadvertant or stealth politcal messaging -- either way, it's simply inappropriate to have this symbol at the deathsite of those killed by Islamofascist radicals. Make it a full circle with three breaks in the trees to allow entry. (I say three, not four, because four entrances would sketch out the points of a cross, and then the left would be screaming holy hell, wouldn't they? Suddenly symbolism would be quite important to those currently denying it.) I still think it's a sorta crappy abstract tree-huggy design, but trees are nice enough, and it's certainly better than the other crap designs offered. And, By The Way... For those who say "the families chose this design," well, again, only a few representatives of the familes of the dead were on the panel to choose a design, and further, as can be seen from this article, the other designs were just plain ugly. Typical abstract post-modern avant-garde-ism, with a bit of Soviet Futurist design tossed in for good measure. If the families want trees and windchimes, fine by me. But I'm having trouble with the left's resistance to a circle over a crescent. Is there some particular reason they're determined to have their crescent? It's a little odd that they can say the crescent means absolutely nothing at all and yet get so angry over the suggestion that it be replaced by an uncontroversial (and, frankly, more apprpriately symbolic) circle. If the crescent means nothing, then why not swap it with another shape that also means nothing? posted by Ace at 08:54 PM
CommentsMan oh man . . . I can't wait for the readout on this one. -T Posted by: The Therapist on September 10, 2005 03:35 PM
Shanksville (the crash site) is near Pittsburgh; it's just a reference on the map. This is too awful for words. Posted by: on September 10, 2005 03:42 PM
Leave it to some sick lefty to believe we need to "embrace" Islamic radicals. Why doesn't the sick designer-idiot go embrace OBL and see if the rag-head breaks down and weeps a KUMBAYA? These radicals can not be bargained with. They cannot be "understood." They cannot be hugged into secular humanism. These Islamists want to bring "peace" to America by the approved methods of the Q'uran. There are 3 approved methods, 1: convert your ass to Islam, 2: Force you into dhimmitude (racial degradation with abusive taxation), and, 3: kill your ass. The Islamists will not stop until America is under sharia law or we kill their asses. End of story. Make more bullets; we're going to need 'em. Posted by: William Thrash on September 10, 2005 03:52 PM
Would it be wrong to encourage people to bring pork products to the dedication? Maybe leave said products as an offering to the victims? Was Todd Beamer a Jimmie Dean Breakfast Links kind of guy? Posted by: BumperStickerist on September 10, 2005 03:56 PM
qibla |?kibl?| (also kiblah) noun [in sing. ] the direction of the Kaaba (the sacred building at Mecca), to which Muslims turn at prayer. ORIGIN mid 17th cent.: from Arabic ?ibla ‘that which is opposite.’ Seems to be it should be more easterly, but what do I know. Posted by: Kevin on September 10, 2005 04:03 PM
Yeah... that's one of the things I don't get. I'm not sure if the map has been reversed or what. Posted by: ace on September 10, 2005 04:08 PM
I am with those who think Crescent of Embrace is a subversive, ironic, or utopian statement. I am absolutely not with the "Points to Mecca" or whatever crowd. If such a feature is present, it is a coincidence. How do I know this? Again, I don't find it that hard to see how leftists think. I've hung around them long enough. An important feature of any modern art is to get the public to react differently from the arts community. Either the crescent expresses hope that the West and Islam will one day embrace, or it is a monument to the attackers. Artists will immediately see both possibilities without any assistance and think it is cool, but the average Joe won't see it, even when it is pointed out. This is an ideal situation for the author of the work. And this is exactly how it is being played out. Garnering praise from both groups, but for different reasons. But nobody -- and I mean nobody -- would know where the axis of the crescent is pointing, so therefore it is a coincidence. Bottom line: you do it if another artist will immediately see the angle be in on the joke. You don't do it if no one gets the joke without pulling out a sextant and a protractor. An archtypical example of the dynamic here: Salvador Dali made a painting that looked like it was his usual surrealist stuff. It was housed in a horizontal case, and the back of the case was a decorative steel cylinder. Or it appeared to be decorative. If you looked at the reflection of the painting in the cylinder, you were confronted with the unmistakeable image of a hairy cock. Half the people filing by the exhibit would try to figure out what the painting "meant," and the other half would look at the cylinder and start laughing at the first half. I am sure Dali would have been upset if this work were displayed without the cylinder. The cylinder has to be there or the effect is lost on everybody. "Points to Mecca" has no cylinder. Posted by: caspera on September 10, 2005 04:11 PM
The point might actually be that the it's the midpoint of the crescent, not the open arms, that are supposed to point to Mecca. She said something about a "bow" pointing; maybe she means imagine an arrow in that bow, and the arrow points to Mecca. It depends, I guess, on how the points of the crescent are defined. I don't know if there is a definition or if SarahW is just hypothesizing. This is one of those links that is too intriguing to not not link. Although, as I admit, I have no idea if it's true, or even if I understand her thinking. Then again, I met her husband at CPAC, and he seemed levelheaded. He was dressed as a Colonial-era town crier, tri-corner hat and clanging hand-bell,* so I have to imagine that SarahW is just as sane. * No, really. That's who Sarah told me to look for, and goshdarnit, if I didn't pick him out of the crowd immediately. Posted by: ace on September 10, 2005 04:12 PM
So as long as you dont offend the muselums its okay and that jerks at the ACLU will approve what a bunch of stupid jackasses Posted by: killdeer on September 10, 2005 04:13 PM
Maybe the quibla angle is the initial direction of the great circle route - aka the reason why airplane routes are curved. Surprisingly enough, the shortest distance between two points on earth is not a straight line. Try it with a piece of string and a globe. Whent taut, the string is the shortest distance between two points, but the angle of travel in relation to north pole is constantly changing. FWIW, the quibla angle in San Diego is 25 degrees, so it's mecca via canada. Posted by: Kevin on September 10, 2005 04:23 PM
Not sure that a 7th Century religious text would take into account the "great circle"/airplane route consideration. Posted by: ace on September 10, 2005 04:28 PM
If you read his 'philosophy' on architecture, it's not hard to reach the conclusion that this guy did in fact choose the crescent for exactly why we're speculating. Here's the end of it More than problem solving however, we aspire to emotionally affect and uplift our lives through poetry and beauty. It is through these transcendent qualities that we optimistically strive for ways to enrich life and fulfill our original purpose for engaging in the practice of architecture.”
Posted by: Lydia on September 10, 2005 04:31 PM
Woops, that whole thing was s'posed to be italicized.. wtf? Anyhoo.. what flowery prose to describe architecture. Good grief. Why doesn't the sick designer-idiot go embrace OBL and see if the rag-head breaks down and weeps a KUMBAYA? Indeed. Posted by: Lydia on September 10, 2005 04:35 PM
Don't we have to figure out the great circle route to Mecca that the arrow would travel, like a plane? Which could take you over the polar ice cap, for all I know. Posted by: Michael on September 10, 2005 04:42 PM
The direction of the qibla (the imaginary line you point yourself along when you pray to Mecca) from North American is a mostly settled controversy among believers. I'll excerpt this because it's on point: "If you look at a standard flat map of the world, you notice that New York is north of the 40th parallel, while Mecca is south of the 22nd parallel. Therefore the local qibla must be approximately east by southeast, right? Wrong. The computer and most Muslim authorities agree that the qibla in North America is to the northeast, ranging from 56.3 degrees for Washington, D.C., to 23.7 degrees for Los Angeles." At the bottom of my blog post I have appended a link to the qibla calculator I used, so you can see where I got my little map or make your own. this link is to another prayer time/quibla guide for Philly. Here is a somewhat more elegant. azimuth map I linked to on my blog made by Etaoin Shrdlu, whose name I don't understand...but he makes a nice clear map of the qibla all the way to Mecca from the site in PA. Another fellow, D. Edgren, made a map similar to mine showing the qibla calculated from the crash site coordinates. All show the "crescent embrace" reaching out along the qibla from Mecca. Blogger gives me about a minute to write things before it "vanishes" them into the ether...but I'll make a point to add a definition of the qibla. Posted by: SarahW on September 10, 2005 04:46 PM
Sarah, Thank you, I was being an idiot. I've updated the post to take away my confusion and caveats and state that your theory is well-founded and quite confirmed. Posted by: ace on September 10, 2005 04:50 PM
Kevin, Michael: Yes indeed, the shortest route to Mecca, according to Muslim authorities, does go by the "great circle," in this case right over the North pole. The Qibla finder link is quite right and in accordance with Islamic teachings on the subject. Posted by: ace on September 10, 2005 04:56 PM
Uh...you guys have noticed that the "pointing" of the crescent is cockeyed, haven't you? It's askew--actually, the crescent appears to be pointing over at China (if you assume the midpoint of the crescent is the point). Frankly, you all are a bunch of idiots. I thought my party was the party of idiot conspiracy theorists. Thank you, GOP, for proving that the tinfoil hat brigade exists on both sides of the aisle. Posted by: Jeff Fecke on September 10, 2005 05:01 PM
Look at the ends of the crescent, not the ends of the fattest row of trees. Yes, the midpoint of the fat row of trees does not point to Mecca. But the entire crescent does. Posted by: ace on September 10, 2005 05:03 PM
BTW, a conspiracy requires two people (yes, the crime itself is an individual crime, but you need to agree with someone else that the crime would be committed). This isn't necessarily a conspiracy... it's just one douchebag's little joke/stealth message. Posted by: ace on September 10, 2005 05:04 PM
I think it's supposed to be payback for all the christian symbolism embedded in our culture that's barely noticable. Remember symbolism is fundamental to the postmodern left and they hate christian symbolism as much as muslims do. The connections between postmodernism, the radical left and radical islam are fairly substantial. Good ol' ayotalla Komini exiled in France with the postmodern philosophy crowd before taking over Iran. Posted by: boris on September 10, 2005 05:15 PM
'Course, the fact that maples turn red in the fall might be of interest. Posted by: Phil Smith on September 10, 2005 05:30 PM
A bit off topic, but Kuwait airways has a mecca finder on their 767 in-flight entertainment . The GPS map in the seatback alternates with an arrow pointing to Mecca. Not sure how those guys pray, or how they figure out when to pray (display was in arabic) since there's no room in the seats and prayer time is dependent on astronomical events in your location. Ace, no harm no foul re the great circle. I knew that Navy navigation stuff would pay off one day. Posted by: Kevin on September 10, 2005 05:53 PM
Maybe we should contact the ACLU since they are so efficient at removing Christian symbols--- never mind-what WAS I thinking? Posted by: from the south on September 10, 2005 05:55 PM
I was kind of ticked at first, but now I don't buy it. I'm looking at my yard and gardens, and its difficult to create a pleasant, somewhat informal atmosphere without swooshes, partial curves or crescents. Its a nice shape. It creates a pleasing sweep, demarcation of space. Even if this moron seems to indicate that he is playing around with symbolism that is offensive to the site, all it means is that he is a dick. Unless the designer is a repressed swish that likes big formal squares full of tiny closely- clipped plants, I can virtually guarantee that any other designer would have used similar shapes somewhere in the design. As far as orientation; if you want to grow anything near the trees inside that crescent, you want that thing open somewhat to the southern exposure. Daylight has a lot to do with the design of these things too. Posted by: lauraw on September 10, 2005 06:02 PM
I wonder what course flight 93 was on when it impacted. I'm guessing the crescent's alignment doesn't match up at all. Also, the red maples represents the blood of the victims er martyrs er victims. Or something like that. Posted by: Kevin on September 10, 2005 06:05 PM
Some people wouldn't be happy unless a male voice said "Let's Roll!" as people filed through the portal. Posted by: BumperStickerist on September 10, 2005 06:17 PM
I find it telling that in the proposed design, the crescent is a much more muted and less distinct arc -- it reads to me like something trying to be snuck under the radar of the panel, although I suppose the current shape could just be the result of natural refinement. I dunno about this one still. Posted by: Il Padrino on September 10, 2005 06:29 PM
Looking at the relative exposures of the gardens in my yard, which is in CT. A southwestern orientation (of the opening of the crescent) would give the maximum possible sunlight exposure to the inside of the crescent for the longest possible time over a northeastern season. If he faced that thing the other way, the inside of the crescent would be shady as all hell after about 11 am except for in high summer. If he faced it partway in other directions, he'd have one side where you could only grow shade plants, and one side where it was scorching every afternoon in summer. And the lower sun in Fall and Spring would make it quite dim and shady during those seasons. I'm just sayin'. Posted by: lauraw on September 10, 2005 06:32 PM
Laura, A circle could be made upon a hill or inclined surface such that the lower-lying trees provided very little shade to the interior of the ring. Just as a for instance. There's no doubt that curves and crescents are nice shapes. Still, I'm sorry, but there are other shapes, and the crescent, as nice and natural as it is, is just inappropriate here. Posted by: ace on September 10, 2005 06:34 PM
Didn't say that right; if he faced it exactly the other way, the inside of the curve would only have light for a few hours in the middle of the day during Spring and Fall, thus making it a cold and miserable place to be during those seasons. Posted by: lauraw on September 10, 2005 06:37 PM
I don't see how you can avoid it completely in landscape design. You'd have to bend over backward. Take a look at the (casual) designs in areas around you. If he made it more of an asymmetrical swoosh, do you think you'd still pounce on it? Posted by: lauraw on September 10, 2005 06:41 PM
Nope. Look, the thing is a crescent shaped almost exactly (and with the same endpoints) as the Islamic crescent. What is the point, incidentally, of extending the crescent (those red lines on the pic) so far past the trees? Why can't the trees just stand in a semi-ciricle which doesn't resemble a crescent? Posted by: ace on September 10, 2005 06:46 PM
I'm looking at my yard and gardens, and its difficult to create a pleasant, somewhat informal atmosphere without swooshes, partial curves or crescents. Its a nice shape. It creates a pleasing sweep, demarcation of space. Actually, I'm also looking at my front yard right now, outside my home office window. I recently shelled out thousands to have it professionally landscaped. Frigging crescents all over the place, like dry stack stone edging around the gardens and so forth, "embracing" ferns and ornamental grasses and shit. I wonder how many are pointing at Mecca. I'll bet my Islamofascist landscape architect, Bruce, is laughing his ass off at me. Posted by: Michael on September 10, 2005 06:48 PM
I am not making this up--QVC is selling a Katrina memorial pin--it has a white flower with a silver crescent on a blue ribbon Item number J-02247. The reason a white flower was chosen was to represent the state flowers of Alabama (camellia), Mississippi and Louisiana (magnolia). NO is the cresecent city-- The back of the pin has engraved hope, help and heal. Cost is 16.50 with 8 of it going to Red Cross. Interesting........
Posted by: from the south on September 10, 2005 06:51 PM
That's Food Network was Steve Erkel Fans-like me. Posted by: from the south on September 10, 2005 06:52 PM
Sigh. Couldn't they just make a lifesize bronze statue of the interior of the plane just as they're saying "Let's roll!"? Then you could really appreciate who these people were and exactly what they were going through. That's a memorial, and it could even point to Mecca for all I care. Posted by: geoff on September 10, 2005 06:54 PM
I'll bet my Islamofascist landscape architect, Bruce, is laughing his ass off at me. Beware the ones with the western-sounding names, Michael. I'm sure everyone was laughing at John Walker Lindh too. AND WHO'S LAUGHING NOW, EH? Posted by: Jeff B. on September 10, 2005 06:56 PM
Here's what I think, said elsewhere: If the embrace coming from Mecca is just a serendipitous coincidence, that's too bad. It's in bad taste, horribly wrong; whatever the intent is has tremendous power to disturb and offend by its associations with the goals and actions of the hijackers. Ok, the name, the geometry, the seasonal color for the anniversary of the planes impact into the field, the litle "star of trees" by the sacred ground ( the designers hame for the crash site) are all coincidences. The arms of the "embrace" of the crescent reaching out along the qibla are just an accident. It's just too much reference to the radical islamist agenda of the airborne jihadis who prayed to allah when they brought down the plane on that spot, claiming it for allah, and a distraction from the heroism of the persons who died fighting them. Posted by: SarahW on September 10, 2005 07:21 PM
Five wouldn't trace a Star of David. That has six points. Five would be a Pentagram. Did any of the victims like heavy metal? Posted by: on September 10, 2005 07:25 PM
Oh yeah. Good lord I'm dumb sometimes. Posted by: ace on September 10, 2005 07:27 PM
What is the point, incidentally, of extending the crescent (those red lines on the pic) so far past the trees? Why can't the trees just stand in a semi-ciricle which doesn't resemble a crescent? Because the trees on the ends would shade out the trees next to them. These are not understory trees. They need full sun. In your 'circle of trees,' you'd have to have two semicircles of trees, the ones on the southwestern exposure able to take full sun (and they couldn't really make a full half circle for the reason above), and the ones on the northeastern exposure of an understory or shade-tolerant type. Or, the land would have to slope dramatically from southwest up to northeast so that the trees on the back side of the sunlight could get their share. Or those northeastern facing trees would have to be of a taller sort than those fronting the sun. Which again creates your evil crescent! Posted by: lauraw on September 10, 2005 07:29 PM
Dang, Laura. You know landscaping. If you get sick of wrapping packages, I'll give you the contract to do my back yard (and cut that Islamofascist Bruce out of the action). Posted by: Michael on September 10, 2005 07:43 PM
A fellow named RG asked a favor of me" "Please note in the LGF comment section for me please, that the Tower of Voices at the entrance to the Flight 93 Memorial is symbolic of the Call to Prayer Towers at the entrances of Mosques around the World." I don't know much about call-to-prayer towers , any thoughts? Posted by: SarahW on September 10, 2005 07:44 PM
Of course, the contract will specify that your husband gets to build a spud gun. Posted by: Michael on September 10, 2005 07:44 PM
Let's be honest: Trees suck for a memorial. First, they're just fucking trees. Second, they can die, and then your memorial looks bad (and anyone that felt their relative was represented by that tree feels bad). Finally, this is only the second tree memorial I've heard of. What was the first? The Columbine memorial where they asshole that put it up had two trees for the shooters because he felt they were victims, too. Clearly something about tree memorials inspires really stupid ideas that insult the victims. Posted by: Fred on September 10, 2005 07:46 PM
We should take up a collection for a decent memorial to be sited directly under the flight path at the point when they said, "Let's Roll!" Posted by: geoff on September 10, 2005 07:51 PM
Posted by: Fred on September 10, 2005 08:02 PM
Let's be honest: Trees suck for a memorial. I can get on board with this. Bronze, concrete, and granite don't give a fuck for light conditions and they don't die. Posted by: lauraw on September 10, 2005 08:19 PM
Slightly cleaner and labelled version here or here.
Posted by: Etaoin Shrdlu on September 10, 2005 08:29 PM
It is ambiguous, and if you use the ends of the 'red' area which seem more intuitive, it doesn't work at all. It could be a coincidence. I have one of those shapes in my front yard (flowers, not trees), in reverse crescent but probably the same exact orientation, because that's the way the sun reaches everything. But even if the guy did intend the crescent that way, I am saying its unreasonable to go flying off the handle, yes, even in this particular memorial. Because they are so ubiquitous in design as to be meaningless, even if the designer is being a dick. Islam is not the sole brand of crescent shapes, the way that the Nazis OWN the swastika, or Christians OWN the cross. If Islam's symbol were the square, what the hell would we do. Posted by: lauraw on September 10, 2005 09:15 PM
We could put a memorial PLANE there, and the left would see a Cross. . . -T Posted by: The Therapist on September 10, 2005 09:37 PM
Speaking of crosses. Looks like they tried to exclude cross-streets. Posted by: lauraw on September 10, 2005 09:46 PM
Both Swastikas and Crosses are far older than their attendant groups. Crosses have been used in architecture before christian churches even. If a Holocuast memorial was in the shape of a swastika, even a reversed "happy" one, it still would be insenitive and idiotic. These people gave their lives fighting against the red crescent or at least some part of it (insert appropriate "Islam is a religion of peace, they don't mean to blow people into pieces" nonsense here). Reaching out to their murderers, and the murderers of 3000 other Americans that day, just doesn't belong. Posted by: HowardDevore on September 10, 2005 09:54 PM
How does the crescent line up with the starting point of Flight 93? Posted by: Insolublog on September 10, 2005 10:10 PM
Hey Lauraw, you don't gotta buy it. It's sort of the whole deal, including the architects personal emphasis on "visual poetry" that tip the scales for me. Ace - I'd link to Hubby as Patrick Henry but I hate that picture he has on his website. Posted by: SarahW on September 10, 2005 10:21 PM
Really? I thought he had one, but I may be misrembering. And yeah, I know he doesn't, you know, dress like that on a daily basis. Posted by: ace on September 10, 2005 10:30 PM
Why not have a broken cresent symbolizing that the brave Americans on that plane kicked the muslims butts. Posted by: Jim on September 10, 2005 10:56 PM
I understand where you're coming from Sarah. I don't think I have to defend not liking heavy Islamic references at that memorial site. No of course not. I'm just saying the plan is too generic for me to see that. Posted by: lauraw on September 10, 2005 11:07 PM
Michael, You'd never think I knew so much about gardening if you saw my yard right now. Only the xeric stuff fared well, we've had so little rain. Except for the lotus, which is beautiful because I've babied it, taller than me (not much of an accomplishment actually) and about to pop a couple big buds. Almost time to tear it all down for Fall. And watch the red maples do their thing. Red maples are popular landscaping trees because they are superb shade trees, also disease free, long lived, symmetrical, and spectacular when they flame up against the bright blue Autumn sky. Being under a red maple in Fall makes you glad to be. Posted by: lauraw on September 10, 2005 11:27 PM
If the crescent does, in fact, line up perfectly with Mecca (you know, to within 0.5-1.0 degrees with respect to its orientation) it is in no way a coincidence. That is just too freakin' perfect. If the trees need light, fine... rotate the damned thing one half of one degree "clockwise" and make it point to Cairo or something. The idea that the trees require it to precisely point to Mecca is a stupid one. Oh, regarding the path of flight 93... News articles have stated that the crescent is meant to embrace the path of the plane or something or another... this can't be the case if the plane was headed toward D.C., since it is southeast (isn't that correct?). Even it that were the case, it strikes me as odd that the southeastern tip of the crescent was intentionally made to be longer than its compliment... almost as though the line that is orthogonal to the tips of the crescent was being aimed at something. Oh, well... this will be dismissed as some wacky conspiracy theory. If the families are still happy with the design after these possibilities are raised then so be it.
Posted by: Dave S on September 10, 2005 11:34 PM
Laura, You'd never think I knew so much about gardening if you saw my yard right now. Only the xeric stuff fared well, we've had so little rain I'ts been a rough year for my yard also. Lost an expensive Japanese red maple, Irish moss is dying in the rock garden, and so on. Plus, the frigging deer keep eating my Hostis, a good shady area plant, but how do you keep the frigging deer away? I've got a tree hydrangea right outside of my home office window which is in full bloom, and it looks great. I've been watering it by hand. Posted by: Michael on September 11, 2005 12:11 AM
The deer will win. Plant something they don't like. Posted by: lauraw on September 11, 2005 12:18 AM
...though other people on my gardening site say that a sprayer works fine to deter the deer. You've seen the things in gardening catalogs. As soon as something crosses the infrared beam, the thing starts revolving and shooting jets of water and the critters scatter. Posted by: lauraw on September 11, 2005 12:21 AM
Personally, I seed the garden with dog hair from brushing my dogs. The bunnies and deer don't like it. Pretty much anything that smells like a predator or that smells like meat or offal will offend their little vegetarian noses. Posted by: lauraw on September 11, 2005 12:23 AM
The deer will win. That's actually the conventional wisdom in Texas, where your landscape guy (unlike Bruce in Ohio) will deer-proof the unenclosed portions of your yard with plants they don't like. Hmmm. Kinda makes me wonder, because Bruce seems to know the pool boy, and Mrs. Michael is actually the one who ordered up this deer-vulnerable landscape plan that's going to take lot's of repeat visits . . . Posted by: Michael on September 11, 2005 12:37 AM
Modestly off-topic, but consider what day this is: We believe there is a lack of (or maybe "ANY") 'appropriate' 9/11 memorials, anywhere. We've put our own 5 minute video memorial online. No burning buildings, no rubble, no explosions, no speeches, no screeches, no Bin Laden, no bodies. (No kidding.) Just a remembrance of some people whose lives were cut short through no fault of their own, with poignant candid snapshots from their lives, and music. Thought you might want to spend a few moments today, remembering. http://mistersnitch.blogspot.com/2005/09/our-after-911-site-is-online.html Posted by: Mr. Snitch! on September 11, 2005 12:45 AM
Personally, I seed the garden with dog hair from brushing my dogs. The bunnies and deer don't like it. I knew people in Texas who collected human hair from the floor of their favorite hair salon and spread it in their yard on the same theory. Didn't work. Frigging Texas deer got used to it and ate there landscaping. Posted by: Michael on September 11, 2005 12:49 AM
As a member of the ACLU, I'm opposed to the use of the crescent because of its association with Islam and the Virgin Mary. /sarcasm Posted by: Robert on September 11, 2005 01:02 AM
If they've got the balls to design a crescent shaped memorial for the heroes killed by Islamo-hey ,I hope my 72 virgins are all thin-nuts, then they certainly have the balls to point it to Mecca. They know you wont do shit about it as long as it doesnt interrupt Survior. Posted by: Loyal 9 on September 11, 2005 01:22 AM
Why not have a broken cresent symbolizing that the brave Americans on that plane kicked the muslims butts. EXCELLENT idea! Put a nice break in the crescent. Hey, it's an inadvertant crescent, right, that doesn't symbolize anything, right, so what harm will putting a break in it do? Nothing! Posted by: Fred on September 11, 2005 12:35 PM
I don't get it. When I go to the Qibla finder, I get a result of 54.4 degrees from North for Somerset, Pennsylvania from the actual "prayer times" section. Why is that? Posted by: Auguste on September 11, 2005 01:45 PM
Lauraw: "No of course not. I'm just saying the plan is too generic for me to see that. Its probably just me." It may not be just you. Anyone else who is willing to accept that the crescent is utilized in the proposed memorial only because it is a generic shape that the designer likes and in fact it is only by pure coincidence that the crescent is also an acknowledged symbol of Islam - especially in the color red - would believe it as well. Additionally, one would have to accept that while every other shape, color, sound, and design element in the memorial was carefully and deliberately chosen and placed because of its ability to convey an aspect of the memorialized event to those experiencing the memorial, the crescent was chosen because it was a nice generic shape that it does not communicate anything whatsoever about the event being memorialized. The designers are responsible for the various interpretations perceived in the minds of viewers and I'm sure they spent a tremendous amount of time, thought, and energy reviewing the design for all its perceptions and interpretations. Further the perception of the crescent by the intended viewer in context at ground level is subtle to the point of being subliminal due to its size, elevation, and materials of which it is comprised. One would have to accept that this aspect of the design is pure coincidence as well. We would have to accept as well that if the designers missed an unabiguous Islamic connotation within their design after spending thousands of man-hour in reviewing it to determine how visitors would perceive the design, then they are incompentent bordering on stupid. They are neither incompetent nor stupid. Posted by: F15C on September 11, 2005 03:22 PM
Another aspect of the design seems odd to me. With symmetry as a strong design element overall, the 'sacred ground' is placed asymmetrically within the design itself. If the design were mine, the major elements of the design would focus on the sacred ground. But from what I can tell, in the existing design, they do not. Why didn't they rotate the crescent 30 degrees or so counter clockwise resulting in the sacred ground being the focal point? My observation may be spurrious as there may well be perfectly legitimate reasons for the orientation of the crescent as it is, but it would be interesting to find out exactly why the sacred ground resides where it does within the design. Posted by: F15C on September 11, 2005 03:32 PM
Somerset, PA, which is much closer to Shanksville than Pittsburgh is, has a Qibla angle of 55.08 degrees, as compared to Pittsburgh's 54.4 degrees. I think your first instincts were correct, Ace. Posted by: Auguste on September 11, 2005 04:33 PM
Posted by: The Liberal Avenger on September 11, 2005 04:50 PM
I ran some numbers and it sure looks like the thing points at Mecca. See here: http://www.politicalities.com/politicalities/2005/09/it_points_towar.html Posted by: Voice of Reason on September 11, 2005 06:58 PM
Ok, so I am a pretty open minded, liberal gal but I have to say that this "memorial" is crazy. What the hell was this guy thinking? This is not the place to honor or tribute Islam (and only a fool would claim that the crescent doesn't reference Islam), this is a place to remember the victims on that airplane, the injury to our entire country. This "artist" should be fired and the whole project redesigned. Let him build his own tribute to Mecca elsewhere. Posted by: jane on September 11, 2005 08:18 PM
Is there some particular reason they're determined to have their crescent? What does a crescent look like when you put a handle on it? Q.E.D. Posted by: Tony on September 11, 2005 09:02 PM
FYI, I did link to a map that used the GPS coordinates of the "sacred ground" portion of the crash site. (55+ degrees from the north, calculated by a D. Edgren) I used the Pittsburg numbers cause it was the closest I could get to the latitude/longitude of the memorial using that qibla calculator providing an "official" diagram I could overly on the memorial site. Over-emphasis on perfection of a match within 1 or fewer degrees( with no accounting for scale) seems to miss the obvious. If it's close to the qibla, it's too close. Even if it's an accident and not design, considering all the other uncomforable association with islamic imagery. My early guestimates were that the qibla was between 55 and 57 degrees, and they were all too close for comfort.
Posted by: SarahW on September 11, 2005 09:21 PM
Voice of reason - thanks for doing the heavy lifting. Posted by: SarahW on September 11, 2005 09:27 PM
Voice of reason - thanks for doing the heavy lifting. Posted by: SarahW on September 11, 2005 09:27 PM
Nice try, Liberal Assmonger, but, to paraphrase the Soup Nazi, "No hits for you!" Posted by: zetetic on September 11, 2005 09:28 PM
Leave it as it is, only include a targeting recticle. Posted by: on September 12, 2005 01:06 AM
I will say this: If the families, after listening to all this raving lunacy as well as the coolheaded rebuttals by the suave and debonair leftosphere, find this image to be offensive, let the crescent be changed, reoriented, or turned into a duodecagon. I won't stand in the way, because in the end it's less my - or your - memorial than it is theirs. Posted by: Auguste on September 12, 2005 01:54 AM
Auguste: I read your analysis at your site, but it is neither insightful nor informed. And I think a good thesaurus would recommend "supercilious" as the appropriate adjective, vice "suave"or "debonair." That said, I don't disagree with your last statement, though our collective interest and ownership should not be discounted. Posted by: geoff on September 12, 2005 02:20 AM
You have all fallen for some clever misdirection, I'm afraid. Look at the map at the top of Ace's post. Long before reaching Mecca, the line passes directly through Paris, France. Go up and look, I say. Why would this be? Because it's not a "crescent", it's a croissant! It's a clear jab at red blooded Americans by a bunch of pansy French pastry chefs. I mean, who else goes into landscape architecture but croissant-eating pansies? And to top it all off, the croissant surrounds the sacred ground, planted with a variety of wildflowers. From above it looks suspiciously like the surface of French toast, and get this, the croissant itself is formed by maple trees. Sugar maples. The tree that produces SYRUP! Could he make the insult any clearer??? Does he have to make fun of Americans who died just after breakfast? The architect can shove his "French Croissant of embrace" and his sanctimonious, syrupy breakfast jabs where the sun don't shine!
Posted by: George Turner on September 12, 2005 03:06 AM
I talked about this on the radio on Saturday on a show called Straight From The Hip. Links to the audio can be found on my blog - this topic is sprinkled throughout the first hour of the show. I'll be doing a blogger segment on this show every Saturday, so if there are topics you think would make good radio, let me know. The segment is about blogging and bloggers and I generally mention several different sites each week (although AoSHQ was the only one this week), so tell me about your blog! Posted by: Joel (No Pundit Intended) on September 12, 2005 09:29 AM
but how do you keep the frigging deer away? I use claymores with trip-wires. Posted by: Dave in Texas on September 12, 2005 10:21 AM
I would like to take this chance to suggest a refreshing drink that could be served at the memorial. The national drink of all muslims, allah approved "Swine Sperm Beer!" Allah’s camel-swine sperm beer, to please Allah of course. Muhamhead's Allah approve swine sperm beer. Brewed right in Mecca. Made of nothing but pure pig c um taken in the traditional way, by mullahs giving blow jobs to the mosque's pigs. Sura 53: 21-24 "And Muhamhead rose from the desert and was dry in the mouth. Allah our might pagan pig moon god spoke and instructed Muhamhead to suck swine penis and save the sperm to be brewed in the Whorehouse Kabba Bar of The Black Stone in Mecca." Yes my fellow goat herding camel fuckers, allah approve Swine Sperm Beer will help you get those 9 year old girls drunk. After all it worked for our False Prophet Muhamhead (piece of pork be upon him) That's right Muslims, no Arab pedophile wedding or liberal appeasment would be without Koran approved "Allah's Swine Sperm Beer. Get it a a Mosque near you. Posted by: Pagan Piggy Goddess Allah on September 12, 2005 10:35 AM
Everyone knows that Islam has nothing to do with terrorism, so why the big deal about a crescent? Anyway, all right-thinking people know that the martyrs of Flight 93 were simply punishing Amerikkka for what we did to the Indians, Africans, Arabs, and so on. The Little Eichmanns of Flight 93 should not be celebrated at all. They should be condemned for preventing the martyrs from achieving their goal of having the chickens come home to roost. In their remaining time on this earth, the fascists of Flight 93 should have taken the opportunity to convert to Islam, the one true religion, and helped the martyrs direct the plane into the house where Chimpy McBushitler lives. The memorial could then be in the shape of a giant oil well.
Posted by: Dhimmi Crack Corn on September 12, 2005 11:11 AM
'I use claymores with trip-wires." THIS SIDE TOWARD CERVIDAE Posted by: BrewFan on September 12, 2005 11:23 AM
I'd like to point out that I mentioned this whole idea back on the 8th. Not that I did anything to prove it, mind you... http://blog.mu.nu/cgi/splorp.cgi?entry_id=116972 Search for "Sean" Posted by: Sean on September 12, 2005 01:18 PM
re: the qibla-- Wretchard does the math. Posted by: matoko kusanagi on September 12, 2005 02:22 PM
I did another little diagram calculated from Somerset instead of Philly. It's Zombified; that is, animated with a frame of the crescent from Zombie's animated gif. Posted by: SarahW on September 12, 2005 04:11 PM
Rats, I missed a pair of quotes. Here is a link to the Somerset qibla zombified diagram. Posted by: SarahW on September 12, 2005 04:15 PM
I love the diagram, but two points: There are adjacent stands of two species of maple, both native to the area and appropriate for the climate and soil: red maple (red in autumn) and sugar maple (orange in autumn). The semicircular shape, a standard in the landscape architect's repertoir, responds to the existing lay of the land. :) Posted by: Sissy Willis on September 12, 2005 05:38 PM
. . . repertoire . . . I should have previewed. Posted by: Sissy Willis on September 12, 2005 05:39 PM
How can you tell it's pointing towards rather than turning its back towards Mecca? Posted by: Sissy Willis on September 12, 2005 07:38 PM
Been 15 years since I worked for a defense contractor - had to call a friend to confirm my vague recollection, I didn't work directly on this program. We did aircraft mods, including Air Force One. Byproduct of that deal was a lot of "head of state" planes, other countries paying us to create what we called "Good Times Vans" of the skies. We did 8 planes for the Saudis. Very extravagent... gold trimmed plumbing in the lavs, shag carpeting (kidding), on one, a rotating prayer platform (upper deck of a 747 stretch)..no matter how the plane was oriented, the platform turned to point to Mecca the software we wrote calculated qibla using 1) great circle and 2) shortest distance. Posted by: Dave in Texas on September 12, 2005 10:00 PM
Sissy, don't bother. They're rolling. Posted by: lauraw on September 12, 2005 10:32 PM
The argument is ending up to be, even if it was a complete coincidence, which I do believe it was, any feature with a red crescent is inappropriate for this particular monument. If the city of Mecca could not avoid cross-streets, and didn't get anal about making sure they weren't created (and lord knows those people obsess over symbols), I don't see why we should get obstinate about a monument which follows the lay of the land; contains the color red which symbolizes blood, valor, and sacrifice; and honors our valorous dead with a peaceful place framed by spectacular trees which blaze amazing colors about the time of their sacrifice. Wretchard said that even though there was a 1 in 9 chance that the crescent would be oriented the way it was, it is still inappropriate. I wouldn't be surprised if the trees were chosen before the final design of the central area, red maples are that special and desirable for landscaping. Look, when I see somebody holding the American flag in the wrong direction, I get angry. As far as the designer's 'poetry' references; again, poetry has different meanings to different people. I think red trees flaming forth as near as possible near the time of their sacrifice is a tribute. Kill me! I really do. Posted by: lauraw on September 12, 2005 11:08 PM
Lefty Architect use of color red for And we over 35 also seem to recall the relationship of the color RED and a crescent like shape to that enemy now THE USSR - OFF THE MAP - OUT OF HISTORY. but RED China is still on map. But the midpoint of the whole crescent, starting at one slender tip, ending at the other, does seem to point straight to Mecca. Coincidence? Or design? " So both are correct. A great sophomoric They must be so proud. Posted by: larwyn on September 12, 2005 11:23 PM
May I suggest that the monument be used as is, but with a museum nearby? A single, long building with curved sides, a brown roof coming to points at each end. Let's see, where should it be located? Perhaps, oh, end on to the crescent, to the north east of the center of the crescent? Posted by: Phillep on September 13, 2005 09:55 PM
If the crescent means nothing, then why not swap it with another shape that also means nothing? I agree with this. However, I do not agree that this was done intentionally. We in the blogosphere have a responsibility to maintain a certain objectivity towards such things. Whether the designers meant this or not (and again, I DO NOT think they did) is not relevant. Unfortunate? Yes. But this is mere speculation and, as such, belongs in that realm. Many of your commenters respond to this as if it were fact, and that's troubling. We should all consider the facts of the case and go from there. Posted by: Justin Gardner on September 14, 2005 06:12 AM
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I am a Muslim who has lived in both Eastern and Western societies. I grew up listening to the Doors, Led Zepplin, Fleetwood Mac etc, watching Hollywood movies and American sitcoms, educated in English and had the opportunity to travel extensively. With out any doubt, whatsoever, I can say that there are far more similarities than differences between the two cultures. It is sad and most distressing to see that political leaders on both sides are using religion and politics for their own political gains. This cancerous mentallity is spreading worldwide and we, as rational human beings must fight this myopic mentality. There are good and bad people on both sides of the fence, and we i.e. Muslims, Christians, Jews, Hindus, Buddhists etc. must become one. Please ... lets stop the hatred and misconceptions and together build a peaceful world. Lets fight this cancer together. Lets build understanding. All religions teach peace, lets begin with ourselves.
Posted by: Mike on September 23, 2005 09:44 PM
Lost Verses of the Koran Surah 115: The Pig Bismillah: The hurried flight of the Hegira had led the Muslims to a fertile oasis, where they were at last safe from their many enemies in Mecca. Surah 116: The Pervert Bismillah: And it came to pass that Prophet Muhammad was growing ever hornier and more depraved: In a dream it was revealed by Allah that he was to molest a young girl named Ayesha. Surah 117: The Murderer Bismillah: Mohammed and his followers enjoyed many days away from Mecca at the oasis, home of his oafish brother in law, Abu Bakr, who was also Muslim. Surah 118: The Liar Bismillah: Time passed, and a strengthened Muhammad and his followers left the fertile oasis. The Prophet was joined by his young wife Ayesha and her father, oaf Abu, who left the remainder of his family stranded at the oasis, his wife Umm dying of grief shortly afterward. Surah 119: The Thief Bismillah: A fortnight passed, with many of the remaining people of Medina embracing Islam, and others fleeing for their lives, with the exception of a wealthy merchant named Sabri and his family. Surah 120: The Hypocrite Bismillah: More time passed, with some of Muhammad’s followers finding the Prophet’s actions in Medina going against everything he had preached in Mecca, seeing him as Khalil, the rotten toothed man, and the merchant Sabri had seen him: an evil, debauched rapist, pedophile, liar, and murderer. Surah 121: The Coward Bismillah: Returning to the oasis to gather strength before attacking Mecca, Muhammad and his followers again feasted on the bitter flesh of vermin and partook of the favors of eager women, the depraved Prophet coming unto the veiled, bare breasted Nubian harlot Sheba.
Posted by: A PIG CALLED ALLAH on October 16, 2005 11:47 PM
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