Verrrrrrrrry interesting...

I could handle that, I guess. As long as he doesn't get too mushy when it comes time to replace John Paul Stevens.

He's anti-gun, too.

I like Rudy, but his politics and mentality is too urban for the whole US. You know what he'd be great as? A US senator from NY.

Ace, I'm a Giulani shill as well.

Let's not also forget that Giuliani has more on his resume than leading during the crisis of September 11th. The man also completely revitalized a stagnating city. He is a capable in crisis, but also capable of pushing a strong agenda through. He brought sweeping changes to a city that thrives on bureaucracy. Also, the man has a backbone of steel, and he communicates extremely well. NYC has seen the long-terms effects of Giuliani's vision, and the city is better for it.

The next President is going to have to win the PR battle over the war at home. Regardless of how well things are going on the actual battlefiled, we need someone to directly take on the press and the Left at home. This fight cannot rely on .01% of the population killing the badguys abroad. I think someone outside the current administration would be a better choice (at this point).

Giuliani's has already proven himself to be a well-rounded and strong executive. I don't care of Giuliani ran as a Democrat, Independent, Reform or Stupid Party candidate. He has my vote.

There is a lot to like about Rudy but it will just be very hard for him, or Condi, to finese the abortion issue in the primary. Many ProLifers will hold their noses and vote for McCain if it comes down to a duel between those two. The only way that Rudy or Condi can handle the issue is to say something to the effect that its a state issue and that while they are personally ProChoice they don't believe that it is a problem needing a national solution. I could deal with that.

Tob

There are 2 parts that scare me away from Rudy: His antigun record and (me) not knowing his spending views.

Considering that Bush's spending (& immigration) record has just about wedged the conservatives out of the party, if Rudy is equal to or even more liberal than Bush on those issues it could destroy the party (and until I know more, Rudy's in the HELL NO! category along with McCain).

Rudy could emerge as the Republican Clinton, garnering a majority of the vote and popular support (as many imagine Clinton did), while his party self destructs and loses control over the wheels of government.

And considering where the Republicans have been heading (trying to outpork the Robert Byrd Memorial racial tolerance museum/Rope store) it might not be a bad thing.

Toby hit the nail on the head. I expect Rudy to make an impassioned defense of federalism, and argue that abortion-- regardless of his personal position-- shouldn't be decided by the Supreme Court, but by individual states.

That will be a much easier push for him to take than to "walk back the cat" on a belief he's long held publicly. Plus, it has the added benefit of being true (not always necessary in politics, but welcome whenever it applies).

Cheers,
Dave at Garfield Ridge

The fact that Rudy is qualified to be President is undeniable and the fact that he would make a terrific president is, imho, undeniable. But that fact remains he has skeletons that may not seem bad to New Yorkers but they don't go over well in the Red States. His ex-wife could be used to mount quite a smear campaign.

Michelle Malkin posted a link to an informal straw poll. Check out how Rudy and Condi did:

http://www.patrickruffini.com/archives/2005/09/september_straw.php

Rudi's candidacy comes down to how many Supreme's Bush gets to nominate.

Add two Scalia's to the court, and no one will much care about _Rudi's_ opinion on things one would expect the court to visit, or revisit. (Or re-re-revisit, such as the insanity that is the tangled web of 'Ten Commandments' rulings.)

Keep us updated, Ace. I'll want to know when I need to quit my job and devote myself to Rudy's legions full-time.

Funny thing is, I'm only half joking.

I still don't see Giuliani as a strong player in the western states (west of the Mississippi). He'd need a good western state sidekick or to really start stumping around that half of the country. On the other hand, he's far better than the rest of Patrick Ruffini's list.

Ace: I don't know how much Rudy is paying you, but its not enough. There is no way this guy could win a national presidential race. The guy is a NEW YORKER for god's sake. But the real trouble he will have is with the married women demographic. He had his girl friend instead of his wife hostessing, etc. in gracy mansion while they were still married. You don't know that one of the main reasons Kerry lost in 2004 is because he dropped his first wife and married the Heinz fortune. Bush was a drunk and playboy transformed by his love for his wife into a teatotaler and observant christian. Don't kid yourself that married women didn't respond to that life transforming marriage story. What married woman doesn't wantto change her husband? My wife of 28 years would make me pay the rest of my life if I supported Rudy. Heck I've barely gotten out of the dog house for buying an office building against her wishes, and its making money for us.

Dogstar brings up a key consideration. In terms of abortion, probably the single issue most likely to motivate a base, the President can't personally do anything about it, but the President does appoint the only nine (actually, five) people in the entire country who can do anything about it. And that appointment power -- man, it's so much bigger than any one presidency, you know? Rehnquist has been around since Nixon.

In terms of leadership, I completely agree with PoliPundit. The man has forever established his bona fides in a crisis, and that, I think, is key in choosing a President. Not that he's impervious here, however. An ounce of prevention is worth a pound of cure, and Rudy's ability to clean up a mess is nowhere nearly as important as his ability to prevent a mess. But his stance on immigration and guns suggest he's weak on prevention. After the bomb goes off, I'd be happy with Rudy in office. I'm just not so sure I trust him to make sure the bomb doesn't go off.

Ace, you've had a bunch of posts on Rudy and missed pretty much the bottom line reason why he has a good shot to be #44:

Who do you want, in your gut, running the war for the next four years (after Bush)?

*Unless, of course, he wrecks this marriage too. (Though by john's logic, this guy could never have won.)

Match Rudy with Haley Barbour then you have a strong winning ticket!

You're kidding yourself if you think that the Democrats are going to take it easy and get behind Rudy. Our country is divided, and a Republican president will always be the devil incarnate for the other side.

Rudy should run as a Democrat.

Seriously. I have this weird sick feeling that a wide swath of the Dems would L-O-V-E him in the primaries.

I have this weird sick feeling that a wide swath of the Dems would L-O-V-E him in the primaries.

Why does that give you a sick feeling? It gives me a feeling of euphoria. Imagine a general election between Rudy and, say, George Allen. It's win/win.

It'll never happen, though. Rudy's shown far too much allegiance to the Bushitler to get the true believers to vote for him.

Anyone have any thoughts on this:

If logic holds that a New Yorker can never win the Presidency then why did Hillary start her career in a state that most people think is overwhelmingly liberal? I'm not saying she can win. I just assume that she will run and wants to win. I mean, I assume RG could garner more of the country running as a former NY mayor than she could. So, why would she start here and not in Arkansas?

I think that Rudy is a rare thing:
A tough man of conviction in a sea of spineless wussies.

Having said that, he'll never get through the primaries. Folks in redstate America simply will not vote for a prochoicer...period. I know it's shortsighted, but that's the way it is. Who was the last prochoice repub to win the nomination?
Anyone? ... Anyone? ... Bueller?

Rudy's social issue positions and the gun control thing will kill him in the south and rural west.

Who's George Allen?

I will quit my job and work for his campaign in a heartbeat. I don't think the social issues hurt him - the guy is a skilled politician who can read the tea leaves. And he's got worldwide name recognition, and it ain't for his position on abortion.

Rudy in '08.

This Texas social conservative would vote for Rudy. That he only divorced his wife instead of killing her says a lot about his self control.

Chris, I think the aftermath of 2004 has shown us that the Democrats really, truly believed that they were more appealing to a majority of Americans, and if they could just get the turnout high, they were bound to win. They were astonished when turnout was high and they lost anyway. That's fueling a lot of the current rage.

If you're still living the delusion that you're a majority party, being from New York isn't such a strategic mistake.

I dunno about Rudy's chances, though. And I'm not sure the next election wouldn't naturally go to a Dem. Despite a powershift in the House and Senate that is probably going to be long-lasting, I expect the presidency to go back and forth as usual. People seem to like it that way. And I'm not sure they're wrong, provided the other party isn't largely composed of nutjobs and empty suits.

Tim: It is precisely because of his marriage with Nancy that Ronald Reagan could win. Don't you remember how Nancy looked so star struck at each of his speeches that she must have heard hundreds of times already? The marriage validates the man as someone that women can connect with and appreciate. The way Rudy treated his first wife while they were married hurts him terribly with married women. Have you forgotten how badly Newt was damaged by the revelation that he gave his wife divorce papers while she was in the hospital recovering form cancer surgery?Rudy's treatment of his wife during their marriage did nothing to validate him as a man women could appreciate or connect with.. Don't you realize that Hillary was one of Bill's greatest assets because of their marriage and how it validated him as a man that women could connect with and value? No, you are very mistaken if you believe that married women don't take into account the way a politician relates to his wife and how the wife relates to the man. To them it says that the man has some ability to relate to others in ways other than in a macho, selfish manner. Divorce is not the main problem with Rudy, but rather the way he treated his wife while they were married. Talk to my wife if you don't believe it. If you can convince her of your point of view, you're a better man than I am. P.S. If you successfully convince her, I'll willingly pay you to give me a few pointers. I'd like it if, just once, the last words I have in a discussion with her are something other than "Yes dear, I guess you're right." That's one of the draw backs when you marry a woman who's considerably smarter than you are.

FYI, Rudy was married twice before. His first marriage was to his second cousin. Apparently he had it annulled ... after fourteen years. Not sure what the story is there but it's seldom talked about.

Rudy also had an affair with his press secretary for several years while he was mayor. It was an open secret.

Rudy married his second cousin? Damn, put him on a ticket with Jerry Lee Lewis and those guys would carry West Virginia for sure!

For all the talk about how poorly Giuliani will do in Red States, has anyone thought that he may be the only Republican with a shot in hell of winning California and her 54 electoral points? California for the first time in a long time will be in play for him.

I know the discussion hinges on the fact that Rudy needs to get out of the primaries, but honestly, the man could win the national election in a landslide. They could publicize the gay, 2nd cousing loving into the ground and he's still beat Hillary senseless.

LauraW: You have Rudy confused with McCain. Seriously, I know Dems dying to vote for the guy.

It's a matter of identity: although McCain has a good ACU rating and the like, he identifies with the press elite and not the party -- and will act on this at crucial times. Rudy, despite his more liberal positions, acts and thinks like a Republican.

There isn't a married conservative woman I know that would vote for Rudy. And you gotta have us to win.

We have to nominate a guy who will WIN.

You guys loving him aint gonna do it.

Come on people, the man took the mob down in New York. Kicked them out of the Fulton Fish Market, out of the Jacob Javits Convention center, turned New York from a murder capital of the world into a governable city. His leadership on 9/11 speaks for itself. I would vote for Rudy in a New York Minute!!!

I forgot to mention he reduced the welfare roles in NYC by 2/3rds, created an environment where businees would stay and come to New York, helped set off one of the biggest building booms that is continuing to this day!!!!! I heart RUDY! (In a purely platonic way of course)

Rudy's shown far too much allegiance to the Bushitler to get the true believers to vote for him.

The "true believers" (depending on where you draw the line) are only 20-30% of the electorate.

The loopier the dems get with their candidate, the lower that number becomes. In the solidly democrat Palm Beach county, the dem turnout for Kerry was DOWN (significantly) compared to Gore -- and that after a much harder GOTV effort compared to 00'

Maybe Rudy can't win the primaries because of the conservative wife vote, but that still doesn't mean he wouldn't make the best President.

Bill Clinton wasn't a lousy President because he cheated on his wife, he was a lousy President because his foreign policy was spineless. The fact that people give a crap about stupid shit like this goes to show that we still have a long way to go in judging the ability to be President versus pedantic issues bordering on hyperbole.

Rudy's public resume, the resume that I care about, is objectively superior to any candidate that has been discussed so far. His main weak spots are in issues that are, quite frankly, those that would only be discussed in People Magazine. The only other issue, abortion, is one that even the most pro-life candidate would affect should he get into office.

This is why we get dull, boring, equivocating politicians to vote for at the end of the day.

Then again, I think if Giuliani came out and admitted these "mistakes" he would have a much better shot than some of you are giving him. I don't have much to base this on, but we'll see.

Great guy. I would vote for him for senator in New York, where the best hope is a Rino anyway, but never vote for him for President.

He has so many positions contrary to Republicans that he might as well run as a Democrat. He would never, never survive the primary process.

Been mulling it over Allah.
The true believers didn't want Kerry either but they backed him when they didn't have anybody else.

Rudy hasn't got a snowflake's chance at winning the Republican nomination; but if he ran as a Dem he could win it all. Didn't he start out a Democrat?

He was a shitheel to his wife; Dems friggin love that. It endears him to them.

He would be the kind of 'war hero' (9/11 aftermath leader) the insipid ninnies on the left could tolerate.

Ace can say he'd tone down his anti-gun, pro-choice creds on the trail as a Republican candidate, but I think that underestimates the intelligence of a lot of voters...which is what the Dems have been doing to consistently lose. The public record is out there. Say one thing, but actually BE another thing, doesn't fly anymore. Voters can see through it.

He would appeal to the undecided tweeners more than a fullthroated conservative would at this point in time.

It tickles libs to pretend that they are patriotic, or even conservative. What better candidate to rally behind?

And finally, he could capture a significant portion of the Republican vote.

Damn.

Personally, I'm not crazy about the guy.

Rudy doesn't have to get all the votes, he just has to get more than the next guy.

Who's the 'next guy' who's going to beat him?

Remember, this is a Republican primary. Dark horses need not apply.

Remember the nature of NYC. No pro-life candidate for mayor could win in NYC. Period! Also NYC has over 8million people could you imagine a few million peolple in NYC with firearms. Has anyone been on a NYC subway during rush hour. The mind boggles!

What about Haley Barbour at the top of the ticket, and Rudy as VP? I think that one's got legs, baby, LEGS...

could you imagine a few million peolple in NYC with firearms.

Sure - a few million Bernie Goetz's would tamp down whatever is left of the ruffians and hoodlums in NYC pretty quick.

There's a reason why cretins like Colin Ferguson do their thing in NY rather than Miami. You wouldn't get halfway through your first clip before some strapped geezer(s) dropped you in Miami -- and then pitched your sorry bullet riddled ass into some canal to rot as gator bait.

Calling the cops would be optional...

It tickles libs to pretend that they are patriotic, or even conservative.

For years the biggest joke was hearing moonbats say they would vote for McCain if he was on the ticket in order to appear more normal. If he was on the ticket, they would shit in their pants. (And, no, I'm not suggesting McCain.)

The anti-Rudy folks can run Goldwater again. Or Buchanan. Don't be a one issue person. Especially on issues you think should be left to the states. Also, he's not for confiscating guns. I don't think with Pres Giuliani the folks in Wyoming would have their guns taken away...He is the best man for the job and a real leader.

A vote in Giuliani's favor; his personal betrayals and unscrupulousness.
You'll never be able to say that this guy's mind is clouded by personal loyalties.

Which one of you ponied up for the stamp?!

RWS; monogamous marriage is old & cold. Call the mortician, baby.

Remember Ron and Nancy? Never seen such a disgusting display of snuggle-face and devoted love in all my life. Atrocious. A disaster for our nation. The French were laughing at us.

Monogamy stinks of grandma's doilies and mothballs.

It just isn't Progressive.

OW, don't be ridiculous. Us rethuglicans are rich and don't do mail; we phone in our hate.

The anti-Rudy folks can run Goldwater again. Or Buchanan.

Oh my. Sorry for not thinking Rudy can win. Can I get back in the party now?

He can win. But not on our ticket.

liberal republican seems presidential when compared to a genuine firstclass incompetant. Yeah, great, quite a recommendation...
now must read previous comments.

And by the by, it might be my computer but the right edge of comments is being cut off, making it sometimes hard to catch the whole phrase. The comment display should be resizeable, at least a bit.

Haley Barbour would never make a ticket. He just sounds too Yazoo City Mississippi to succeed nationally in an election. Even red-staters would choke on voting some guy who sounds like a complete yokel.

Don't get me wrong, I'm real proud of our Haley. But he's even to country-sounding for me.

I'm still hoping for a George Allen run. George Allen/Condi Rice? Like a fuckin' hammer.

Allen has, I fear, 'loser' written all over him. Not that this will necessarily keep him from getting the nomination! *cough*BobDole*cough*

As for conservative southern governors, one word: Jeb.

Anyway, Giuliani is a liberal on many issued like gun control, much of his fame as a prosecutor rests on cases that involved questionable charges of financial monkey business ("Your bunny has a good nose"), much of what he did accomplish probably wouldn't have happened if we hadn't seen major changes in the attitudes of higher Federal judges towards criminal rights and other relatively recently invented rights as well as Pataki's election as Governor of New York and the Republican takeover of Congress (eg, welfare ended as a legal right), and so on.
I'd vote for Giuliani for President before I'd vote for Hillary Clinton for Sewer District Associate Commissioner, but I still have my many doubts...
It's late and I hope I'm coherent...

And by the by, it might be my computer but the right edge of comments is being cut off, making it sometimes hard to catch the whole phrase. The comment display should be resizeable, at least a bit.

Bogus video driver.

I'll vote for Hillary before I'd vote for Rudy. If my choice is a Democrat or a Democrat in drag, I may as well vote for the real Democrat.

Fortunately, I expect that after Iowa and New Hampshire, there will be an obvious alternative to Giuliani who will go on to take the nomination. Shoot, even McCain would be better.

Shoot, even McCain would be better.

McCain is a complete fraud. He's as wrapped up in himself as Cindy Sheehan is.

Once people find out about the Kerry/McCain whitewash of the MIA's so Clinton could grant Vietnam MFN status he'll be sunk.

This of course is why dems are in love with him - they know he's got a huge skeleton in the closet that can be exploited on a moment's notice.

Rightwingsparkle,
I am a very happily married, very conservative woman who was privileged to be able to vote for Jesse Helms three times in my life. I would love to find a pro-life conservative who showed the leadership of Giuliani to support for president and by 2008 one may come forward. Until then, I am going to point out the strengths that I believe he brings to the table. I would vote for him in a heartbeat, especially against Hillary Clinton.

As the Anchoress told me, the truth is that if we aren't kept safe, then none of the rest of it will matter and I trust Rudy to keep us safe and/or to go after anyone that attacks us. I think that the rest of it still matters, but if Bush is able to appoint three justices to the SCOTUS then the president's power to influence abortion policy is severely limited.
That's just my two cents.

I live in CA and if he were to get on the ticket, Giuliani would probably take the state. I think there are many centrists from both sides who would love to vote for a fiscal conservative while leaving religion to the churches. I know a lot of dems who want someone who will defend the country and plenty of republicans who don't really care about the aborto/gay thing. All he needs to be is a federalist and not do a 180 on his previous positions

Anybody who thinks Rudy "left his wife for another woman" doesn't know Donna Hanover.

'Nuff said.

I just think if we nominate Rudy we look like hypocrites. The only difference between Clinton and Rudy in most areas is the D or R before their names.

I am a McCain fan. I think he is the only one with the star power to beat Hillary and he has always been right on the social issues enough for the social conservatives. He is a TRUE war hero that is a fact no on can argue with. He has his drawbacks, but so does Rudy. How about a McCain/Rudy ticket?????

McCain/Guiliani?

not me.

McCain/Guiliani?

Nope. I'm not a big McCain fan, because he seems a lot like Clinton to me - he does nothing to interfere with his media popularity. Plus campaign finance reform annoyed me. A lot.

Plus he's whiny.

"How about a McCain/Rudy ticket?????"

No thanks, 'sparkle. I like my conservatives to be, well, conservative.

I am curious though, Sparkle, if Rudy isn't ok with you for Pres, why is he ok for veep?

I should add I'm not a Rudy for President fan, although I do admire the man's accomplishments and respect his ability.

Im wondering why you would support McCain for Pres, Sparkle, when he's trying to shut down & regulate your blog. Bush nearly lost my vote (and did lose my respect) just for signing that debacle desoite his campaign promise not too.

I tend to want a President who doesn't believe in locking up those who criticize him.

And I've seen some referring to Rudi's fiscal conservatism- is he truly a small tax/small government conservative?

S. Weasel, thanks for your thoughts on why Hillary choose NY to launch her Presidential hopes. You said:

If you're still living the delusion that you're a majority party, being from New York isn't such a strategic mistake.

Do you think she was under that delusion? I think the Clintons know the country is moderate to conservative. That Hillary would launch her Presidential bid from NY still doesn't make sense to me. I think she'll continue to appeal to sensibilities in the country that say "protect me at all costs". But will that be enough to dispell the New York liberal moniker (that Giuliani carries as well). And why isn't Giuliani spending more time out in the rural west shedding his label? I guess time will tell.

Plus, McCain met with Cindy Sheehan and offered up a lame excuse for it. Anything for that sweet, sweet, media love.

Being a veteran, criticizing McCain feels like criticizing Jesus but I've never been able to get over the feeling McCain's elevator doesn't go all the way to the top. I agree with Slublog, too, that nobody loves the media lovin' like John.

Hell I thought most New Yawker's had grown to hate Rudy in the year leading to 9/11. You think Dems will cut him any slack? They'll be throwing turds from day 1: smug, fornicating, gay loving, schmaltzy Northeast big-city elitist.

But NOT if he runs as a Democrat.

He could win it.
The only thing stopping him would be party vanity.