Feeding the beast that's killing them.

FANtastic. All the anti-democratic tendencies of the first, but now with extra socialism! I knew there was something fucked up going on when the only signs I actually saw up in Paris opposing the EU constitution came either from Front National fascist psychopaths or University of Nanterre fossilized communists (Les capitalistes disent 'OUI' alors nous disons 'NON'!). Damn--the only available choices in modern Europe seem to be the not-so-fringe fringes in the black or red shorts--or the petty criminals and bureaucrats like Chirac. It would have been nice to believe that 'NON' vote was the product of a Nicholas Sarkozy/Sabine Herold silent neo-liberal majority, but so much for that.

I don’t think he has ever cared about civil liberties – he sees his job as protecting us, not protecting our liberties.

Sneakiest spam ever, Gabe. Well played.

If they change the constitution, all the nations who have already approved it should have to approve it again. Think they actually will be permitted to?

Yay, a Den Beste post!

I think you place too much emphasis on mere formalities like rules. There is probably a harmonizing committee comprised of 4 Oxford women's studies dons.

As much fun as it is to laugh at these chuckleheads I'm going to miss Europe. As amazed as my grandparents were at the changes in their lifetimes, cars replacing horse and buggies, airplanes, men on the moon, I'm not sure the complete colapse from relevance and disintegration of Europe in my lifetime is any less stunning. A really bittersweet moment.

JackStraw:

The collapse of Europe has been underway for a century now. World War I was the death knell -- it's been slow-motion suicide ever since. The world wars exsanguinated Europe, but it also drained out their souls. They gave up on God, and the Americans enabled them to forget about defending themselves.

What I wonder most is: which way will Britain go? Will they stay with the Anglosphere, or get pulled into the toilet along with the rest of the EU? And it may happen that some countries -- Poland, the Czech and Slovak republics -- may keep their heads while all about them are losing theirs.

The collapse of Europe has been underway for a century now.

History might surprise us yet. Advancing technology and increased freedom of movement of information will have hard-to-predict effects. Europe could still snap out of it. I don't know how, but I still have some faith that there could be a good future for Europe someday.

So, Monty, would you say the massive influx of Muslims accelerated the erosion of "old" Europe? Apparently they are not even interested in carrying on any traditions that make them unique.

JackStraw, you keep using this word colapse... I do no think it means what you think it means.

The Arab invasion of Europe began in the mid-1960's after the French lost Algeria. France was at the time suffering from a severe labor-shortage, and to improve their standing in the Arab world they recruited "guest workers" from Turkey, Morocco, Algeria, Sudan, even Syria (countries with a strong French colonial background, in other words). The labor shortage extended to Germany and then Britain, and with the same short-term solution: "guest workers".

Only unfortunately the guest workers stuck around even as the economies cooled down and then went moribund. The workers were placed into huge public housing blocks (ghettoes, in other words), where they procreated with abandon -- but did not assimilate. They were not particularly wanted by their host countries, nor were the Arabs themselves particularly interested in assimilation as such.

But if you think of it another way, the Arabs only filled a void that would have been there regardless. A void of people: the millions upon millions killed in the world wars (and the untold millions never born as a consequence). A void of spirit: Christianity died in Europe after the wars. A void of politics: Europeans decided on stability at all costs. Comfort. Peace.

The irony is that they have a tiger by the tail now, and dare not let go: their unassimilated minorities are still there, lurking in the banlieues and ghettoes. The Arabs are largely jobless and with no prospects, but have come to feel a contempt for the countries they live in -- they look to Islam as the answer to a question they cannot even formulate. I don't blame the Arabs who first came to Europe to work ; they were invited, after all. There was little effort made to integrate them into the larger societies of France and Germany especially; three decades of this neglect have led to a whole generation of Arab young people who have no loyalty to anything more than their own families and the Imam at the mosque.

If Europe is to survive, I think it will come from Central Europe -- they remember the boot of oppression all too well to go quietly into the night again.

Just cause I can't type or spell don't hate me cause I'm beautiful.

Monty

You're so wise. You're like a miniature Buddha, covered with hair.

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