Is the C grade true? Because that's just funny that the LLL have expounded Bush's grades.

Actually, I have no idea. I've never heard what Kerry's grades were. The fact that I haven't heard about those grades makes me strongly suspect they were subpar.

Were he an A student, our liberal media would have made certain we all knew about it.

It was the same way with Gore, who did indeed have lower grades than Bush, though somehow Bush's grades still proved he wasn't fit to use adult scissors.

There's another aspect to this too. That's the fact that Kerry stopped his higher education at the Bachelors level while W went on to earn an MBA from Harvard. So not only did W get better grades than frenchy, he also attained a higher level of education. W then went on to run several successful businesses after graduating while frenchy's best career move was to marry a couple of rich broads and be Mike Dukakis's understudy.

Nah, he's got a JD from someplace because he worked as a prosecutor and then ambulance chaser. Though how he got into law school with those grades defeats me.

Or does it...?

word is he went to Boston College law school...where anyone in Boston with political connections will gladly be admitted...no questions asked.

Bush ran four successful businesses?...hmmm, last time I recall he performance was very poor with those businesses, including his stint with the Texas Rangers where I believe the franchise lost money.(which I also think his other business adventures ended up as well...sorry for the vagueness but im sure you could search around to verify these claims) Oh, and he also traded Sosa for Baines. Also, lets remeber that Bush didn't get into Texas Law School, and that his father was an alum at Yale(hmmmmmmmmm, coincidence) Family connections can be a bitch.

What the hell? John Kerry had no higher graduate training? He has a law degree from Boston College, a top 20 law school.

Bush never tried to get into U of Texas Law Shool or any other school. He never had any intention or ambition to be an attorney. He went to Harvard Grad cChool, where he received an MBA. Incidentlly he is the only US President to have an MBA. And the dems rumor that he was able to get into Harvard because of his father's influence but was not accepted at U of Texas is really quite funny.

Bush did indeeed attempt to get into the University of Texas law school, and was rejected because of poor grades. This is mentioned in several mainstream biographies of Bush which discuss his early years,
including W: Revenge of the Bush Dynasty by Elizabeth Mitchell.
Bush did get into Harvard because of his father's influence. At the time, his father was a high ranking member of the Nixon administration, and had just finished as head of the Republican party.

you're all a bunch of idiots. bush is smarter than kerry will ever be. kerry can't make up his mind about which multi-millionare he should stay married to.

I was once asked if a person declared "brain-dead" by a physician would qualify to vote. I responded in the affirmative. How else do you explain John Kerry's previous polical successes? In fact, "brain-dead" individuals have even become successful cinematographers!

Are you that blind? The Guy is and was an alcoholic cocaine sniffing uneducated prick. What do you think???? His papa got his ass out of trouble hundreds of times and also got him into Yale and Harvard. Plus, I have seen more people with life expereince alone who have more knowledge than those who have actually gone to UCLA, Harvard etc.... 1360 or whatever on the SAT??? Please, he can't even spell SAT. Open your eyes. Kerry is not the ideal candidate, I admit, but shitheads like Bush, Cheney, Rumsfeld, Ashcroft must go. What ever happened to Osama??? I thought he was behind 911 or was it the Bush people themselves giving them an excuse to go into Iraq. You must be on their payroll or something or you are as f**ing stupid as they are. WAKE UP DUMB ASS

Must be quite a burden living with all that blind unthinking rage towards one human being. FOAD, Alpo.

I'm not being a prick, i'm actually doing a paper on these two canidates...but.
i'd like to know if anyone has URL's or Books, or records, that prove John Kerry's and/or George Bush's grades in college?
seems like a bunch hersay on this board.

I don't know what Kerry's or Bush's grades were (although Bush's have been posted in various articles). What I do know is that Kerry's records shows him to be incredibly lazy. He spent FOUR MONTHS in Vietnam and then bailed! He missed 38 out of 49 Senate Intelligence Committee hearings. And, he is currently getting paid as a senator of Massachusetts, but has done nothing over the last year but run for President. A man of the people?!?!? Most people I know are hard-working and SHOW UP TO WORK EVERY DAY!

id like to see some proof that george bush was an alcoholic, and proof that kerry never touched a drop. hey, i would highly consider voting for kerry if i knew where he stood on issues. what i do know is his voting record.

this is a kerry quote from i believe the DNC acceptance speech:

"Vote on my record."

hmmm...alright lets see:

-ranked #1 most liberal senator in the U.S. Senate
-voted the most times out of the entire senate to cut defense and intelligence spending
-voted the most times to increase taxes
-he claims he is a catholic, while he has voted numerous times to increase abortion rights
-he supported the iraq war, voted for it:
"Saddaam is a threat and needs to be disarmed."
"You are a fool if you believe Saddam doesnt need to be disarmed."
then he voted against funding the troops, saying:
"The President failed to fund our troops in Iraq."
actually your richness, YOU failed to support our troops in Iraq.

alright, ill vote on his record. +1 Bush

some other kerry facts:
-owns 7 mansions, including one in Washington, D.C., worth multi millions.
-served in Vietnam for four months, then recieved a discharge for 3 minor wounds (according to the doctor on hand) and received 3 purple hearts for, but he threw those away, or they were fakes, or actaully no one knows (including John Kerry), and protested with Jane Fonda about the war, calling his fellow comrades baby killers commited atrocities.
-he graduated from yale with a low C average, while his counterpart President Bush graduated with a high C-low B average and went on to recieve his MBA at Harvard
-he claims to be a man of the people, a man that will fight the rich; his familys net worth is $700 million. he has never volunteered to pay excess taxes in massachusetts, and makes little or no charitable contributions.
-he is opposed to outsourcing of jobs, yet he and his wife own through Heinz Ketchup 28 manufacturing plants in foreign countries, making a lot of profit obviously off that.
-he claims to be in favor of alternative energy sources, but has opposed windmills off Nantucket and Martha's Vineyard. It must block his view when he and Ted Kennedy are cruising on their yachts.
-he practices his catholic faith when the cameras are turned on and supports abortion rights.
-he owns several *huge* SUVs, the very ones he has said he is against large polluting vehicles and blames Dubya for our energy problems.
-and most interesting, he and other dems claim the Iraq war was for oil; "blood for oil" is their favorite term. but i'm sure they would find it interesting to know that *NOT ONE* tankard from Iraq with oil has arrived at a US port; it has all been sold to Europe and other places, sold BY the Iraqi people, helping pay for reconstruction efforts.

hope you found that interesting

"and that his father was an alum at Yale(hmmmmmmmmm, coincidence) Family connections can be a bitch."

Hmm So what? Thats how Kerry got in too so what's your point?
http://www.cbsnews.com/stories/2004/04/30/politics/main614922.shtml

you guys need open your eyes to "real world"

i'm not a kerry fan...but we, as Americans, must realize that this administration is running America into the ground and slowly but surely wiping out all the civil liberties that each and every American is entitled to...please, see the truth!!!! vote for anybody but bush!!!!!!!

Guys...Bush was an alcoholic and did poorly in school, now he has run our economy down..oh i forgot how many millions of dollars now. Seriously, Bush is just making bad decisions and just needs to LEAVE. Kerry didnt wuss out of Vietnam, that fucker up there doesnt know he got hit like 4 times? i dont think you would want to stay in there if u got shot up would you? i hate disrepectful fuckers like you. Please Vote for a better PRESIDENT, not just some NICE CATHOLIC GUY, we need Brains!

For those of you who have more than half a brain, PapaSmurph is pulling his wanna-be facts straight from the Republican Party's website...another “true-believer” fooled by the spin-mongers. Smurphie, my friend, you aughta get out more…or maybe you should just read more and stop watching Fox News and skimming Sinclair media propaganda.

-Wake-up, Smurphie my lad. Bush and his fellow neo-cons are ruining this once proud nation of ours. They are condemning the environment, ruining the social security system, disassembling the public education system in favor of landslide tax shelters for huge corporations, giving away your retirement benefits and calling it a “tax return” and you swallow it hook, line and sinker. They lie to you, they cheat you of your own money, they sell your children’s future, they wreck your retirement funds, they sell your job to the Indians and the Chinese, they pollute your swimming holes, they send your children and your friend’s children off to fight and die in an unnecessary war, they shirked their own military duty and bold-face lie about it, they ignore and depose furthering scientific research that could cure you or your loved-ones of a life-threatening injury or disease….and still you support them. You are the exact reason I will never vote for a candidate like your "fearless" leader. If there was a foundation for the curing of chronic socio-political, anti-progressive, neo-idyllic stupidity, I’d recommend you commit yourself.

Zeig Heil BUSH, you jackass.

What bullshit.

The subject of John Kerry's military service and why he wouldn't make a good military president has been a topic for debate during this election. The thing I can't understand is how anyone who has NOT been in the military, or served in combat, can say that they are more prepared to lead during a war, or war-like crisis, than someone who has seen war from the front lines.

George Bush not only shirked his duty in the "safe" National Guard during Vietnam, but he doesn't have the sack to come out and admit it. Instead, he bashes Kerry, who, not only went to war by choice, but also led from the front. Who is really the capable wartime president? Who is really better prepared to deal with conflict resolution? The pampered, C-D student, cheerleader, failed-businessman, AWOL, wanna-be Texan-but-actually-from-New-England who was not even elected to his current office? Or, the pampered yet intelligent, decorated Vietnam vet, experienced 20+yr. ELECTED public servant? You, of course, can choose your own cadidate, but don't try to tell me who is the more capable...the choice is obvious.

So, which party really has the most real experience protecting our country? Certainly not the brain-trust neo-con's who brought us the Iraq debacle! Let's just put our cards on the table, shall we?

Here are some actual facts for ya, Smurphie old pal:

Democrats:

* John Kerry: Lt., Navy 1966-70; Silver Star, Bronze Star with Combat V,
Purple Hearts.
* Richard Gephardt: Air National Guard, 1965-71.
* David Bonior: Staff Sgt., Air Force 1968-72.
* Tom Daschle: 1st Lt., Air Force SAC 1969-72.
* Al Gore: enlisted Aug. 1969; sent to Vietnam Jan. 1971 as an army
journalist in 20th Engineer Brigade.
* Bob Kerrey: Lt. j.g. Navy 1966-69; Medal of Honor, Vietnam.
* Daniel Inouye: Army 1943-47; Medal of Honor, WWII.
* Charles Rangel: Staff Sgt., Army 1948-52; Bronze Star, Korea.
* Max Cleland: Captain, Army 1965-68; Silver Star & Bronze Star, Vietnam.
* Ted Kennedy: Army, 1951-53.
* Tom Harkin: Lt., Navy, 1962-67; Naval Reserve, 1968-74.
* Jack Reed: Army Ranger, 1971-1979; Captain, Army Reserve 1979-91.
* Fritz Hollings: Army officer in WWII; Bronze Star and seven campaign
ribbons.
* Leonard Boswell: Lt. Col., Army 1956-76; Vietnam, DFCs, Bronze Stars, and
Soldier's Medal.
* Pete Peterson: Air Force Captain, POW. Purple Heart, Silver Star and
Legion of Merit.
* Mike Thompson: Staff sergeant, 173rd Airborne, Purple Heart.
* Bill McBride: Candidate for Fla. Governor. Marine in Vietnam; Bronze Star
with Combat V.
* Gray Davis: Army Captain in Vietnam, Bronze Star.
* Pete Stark: Air Force 1955-57
* Chuck Robb: Vietnam
* Howell Heflin: Silver Star
* George McGovern: Silver Star & DFC during WWII.
* Bill Clinton: Did not serve. Student deferments. Entered draft but
received #311.
* Jimmy Carter: Seven years in the Navy.
* Walter Mondale: Army 1951-1953
* John Glenn: WWII and Korea; six DFCs and Air Medal with 18 Clusters.
* Tom Lantos: Served in Hungarian underground in WWII. Saved by Raoul
Wallenberg.

26 out of 27 listed here served; of those 26, 18 saw combat; of those 18, 14 were highly decorated.

Republicans -- these are the guys sending people to war:

* George W. Bush: failed to complete his six-year National Guard; got
re-assigned to Alabama so he could campaign for family friend running for U.S.
Senate; failed to show up for required medical exam, disappeared from duty.
* Dick Cheney: did not serve. Several deferments.
* John Ashcroft: did not serve. Seven deferments.
* Don Rumsfeld: served in Navy (1954-57) as flight instructor.
* Dennis Hastert: did not serve.
* Tom Delay: did not serve.
* Roy Blunt: did not serve.
* Bill Frist: did not serve.
* Mitch McConnell: did not serve.
* Rick Santorum: did not serve.
* Trent Lott: did not serve.
* Jeb Bush: did not serve.
* Karl Rove: did not serve.
* Saxby Chambliss: did not serve. The man who attacked Max Cleland's patriotism.
* Paul Wolfowitz: did not serve.
* Vin Weber: did not serve.
* Richard Perle: did not serve.
* Douglas Feith: did not serve.
* Eliot Abrams: did not serve.
* Richard Shelby: did not serve.
* Jon Kyl: did not serve.
* Tim Hutchison: did not serve.
* Christopher Cox: did not serve.
* Newt Gingrich: did not serve.
* Ronald Reagan: did not serve.
* Bob Dornan: Consciously enlisted after fighting was over in Korea.
* Phil Gramm: did not serve.
* John McCain: Silver Star, Bronze Star, Legion of Merit, Purple Heart and
Distinguished Flying Cross.
* Dana Rohrabacher: did not serve.
* John M. McHugh: did not serve.
* JC Watts: did not serve.
* Jack Kemp: did not serve. "Knee problem," although continued in NFL for 8
years.
* Dan Quayle: Journalism unit of the Indiana National Guard.
* Rudy Giuliani: did not serve.
* George Pataki: did not serve.
* Spencer Abraham: did not serve.
* John Engler: did not serve.
* Lindsey Graham: National Guard lawyer.
* Arnold Schwarzenegger: AWOL from Austrian army base.

7 out of 39 listed served; of those 7, 1 was actually in combat. The others served cushy, non-threatening roles. Two of those, including "President" Bush, went AWOL from their duties and did not return. That makes 32 out of 39 that did NOT serve.

Pundits & Preachers
* Sean Hannity: did not serve.
* Rush Limbaugh: did not serve (like he had a pair to begin with?)
* Bill O'Reilly: did not serve.
* Michael Savage: did not serve.
* George Will: did not serve.
* Chris Matthews: did not serve.
* Paul Gigot: did not serve.
* Bill Bennett: did not serve.
* Pat Buchanan: did not serve.
* John Wayne: did not serve.
* Bill Kristol: did not serve.
* Kenneth Starr: did not serve.
* Antonin Scalia: did not serve.
* Clarence Thomas: did not serve.
* Ralph Reed: did not serve.
* Michael Medved: did not serve.
* Charlie Daniels: did not serve.
* Ted Nugent: did not serve.

Umm...none of these guys ponied-up.

Democrats and Republican - notice a pattern here?

Here are some more fun facts for ya, Smurphie old pal:

FY 1999 Defense Authorization - Passage

Bill Number: S 2057
Issue: Military Issues
Date: 06/25/1998
Sponsor: Bill introduced by Thurmond, R-SC.
Roll Call Number: 0181
Bill passed
Full Member List

Vote to pass a bill authorizing $274 billion for military construction, military activities of the Defense Department, and defense activities of the Energy Department.

S 2057: National Defense Authorization Act for Fiscal Year 1999

Vote to pass a bill authorizing $274 billion for military construction, military activities of the Defense Department, and defense activities of the Energy Department. Among other provisions, the bill includes $1.9 billion to continue operations in Bosnia, makes it more difficult for the administration to close military bases without Congressional approval, authorizes a 3.6 percent military pay raise, and authorizes the President to waive a one-year moratorium on the use of anti-personnel landmines.
Bill introduced by Thurmond, R-SC.
(Bill passed 88-4 on 6/25/98)

Bill Status:
Bill Number: S 2057 - 105th Congress (1997-98)
Senate Passage Vote: 06/25/98 - Outcome: Passed
No further action was taken on this bill, never became law. HR 3616 passed instead.

Bill Status:
Bill Number: HR 3616 - 105th Congress (1997-98)
House Passage Vote: 05/21/98 - Outcome: Passed
Senate Passage Vote: 06/25/98 - Outcome: Passed
House Conference Report Vote: 09/24/98 - Outcome: Passed
Senate Conference Report Vote: 10/01/98 - Outcome: Passed
Presidential Action: Signed on 10/17/98
Public Law Number: 105-261 112 Stat. 1920

Senator John Forbes Kerry voted YES.

----------------------------------------------------------------

Military Pay Increase - Passage

Bill Number: S 4
Issue: Military Issues
Date: 02/24/1999
Sponsor: Bill introduced by Warner, R-VA.
Roll Call Number: 0026
Bill passed
Full Member List

Vote to authorize a military pay raise of 4.8 percent in 2000 and annual pay increases through 2006.

S 4: Soldiers', Sailors', Airmen's, and Marines' Bill of Rights Act of 1999

Vote to pass a bill to authorize a military pay raise of 4.8 percent in 2000 and annual pay increases through 2006 of 0.5 percent above the inflation rate. The bill would also provide additional incentives to certain enlisted personnel who remain on active duty for an additional year, provide additional pension options and benefits, and establish a $180 per month allowance for members eligible for food stamps, among other provisions.
Bill introduced by Warner, R-VA.
(Bill passed 91-8 on 2/24/99)

Bill Status: (As of 12/08/1999)
Bill Number: S 4 - 106th Congress (1999-2000)
House Passage Vote: - Outcome:
Senate Passage Vote: 02/24/1999 - Outcome: Passed
Measure returned to the Senate by the House on 11/18/99

Senator John Forbes Kerry voted YES.

----------------------------------------------------------------

FY 1999 Defense Authorization - Veterans' Health Care

Bill Number: S 2057
Issue: Veterans Issues
Date: 06/25/1998
Sponsor: Amendment introduced by Harkin, D-IA; bill introduced by Thurmond, R-SC.
Roll Call Number: 0175
Amendment rejected
Full Member List

Vote on an amendment to transfer $329 million from the Defense Department to the Veterans Affairs Department for veterans health care programs.

S 2057: National Defense Authorization Act for Fiscal Year 1999

Vote on an amendment to transfer $329 million from the Defense Department to the Veterans Affairs Department for veterans health care programs. The transfer would be conducted by the Secretary of Defense in a manner which 'causes the least significant harm' to military readiness and to military personnel's quality of life.
Amendment introduced by Harkin, D-IA; bill introduced by Thurmond, R-SC.
(Amendment rejected 38-55 on 6/25/98)

Bill Status:
Bill Number: S 2057 - 105th Congress (1997-98)
Senate Passage Vote: 06/25/98 - Outcome: Passed
No further action was taken on this bill, never became law. HR 3616 passed instead.

Bill Status:
Bill Number: HR 3616 - 105th Congress (1997-98)
House Passage Vote: 05/21/98 - Outcome: Passed
Senate Passage Vote: 06/25/98 - Outcome: Passed
House Conference Report Vote: 09/24/98 - Outcome: Passed
Senate Conference Report Vote: 10/01/98 - Outcome: Passed
Presidential Action: Signed on 10/17/98
Public Law Number: 105-261 112 Stat. 1920

Senator John Forbes Kerry voted YES.

----------------------------------------------------------------

FY 2001 Defense Auth.-Military Retiree Health Benefits

Bill Number: S 2549
Issue: Military Issues
Date: 06/07/2000
Sponsor: Motion sponsored by Johnson, D-SD, Point of order sponsored by Gramm, R-TX, Amendment sponsored by Johnson, D-SD, Bill sponsored by Warner, R-VA
Roll Call Number: 0118
Motion rejected
Full Member List

Vote to waive a procedural motion that would have killed an amendment that would extend eligibility to the Federal Employees Health Benefits Program to military retirees who joined the services before June 7, 1956.

S 2549: National Defense Authorization Act for Fiscal Year 2001

Vote to waive a procedural motion that would have killed an amendment that would extend eligibility to the Federal Employees Health Benefits Program to military retirees who joined the services before June 7, 1956. The federal government would pay for the full cost of enrollment, which would cost an estimated $92 billion over 10 years. Military retirees who joined the services after June 7, 1956 would be eligible to enroll in the program, but would have to pay the same fees as federal employees.
(Motion sponsored by Johnson, D-SD, Point of order sponsored by Gramm, R-TX, Amendment sponsored by Johnson, D-SD, Bill sponsored by Warner, R-VA)
Motion rejected 54-46: R 17-36; D 35-10 on 06/07/2000.

Senator John Forbes Kerry voted YES.

----------------------------------------------------------------

FY 2001 Defense Authorization-Nuclear Weapons Systems

Bill Number: S 2549
Issue: Military Issues
Date: 06/07/2000
Sponsor: Amendment sponsored by Warner, R-VA; Underlying amendment sponsored Kerrey, D-NE; Bill sponsored by Warner, R-VA
Roll Call Number: 0119
Amendment adopted
Full Member List

Vote on an amendment that would allow the president to make further arms reductions only after the Defense Department submits its quadrenniel defense review and an overall report on the status of the U.S. nuclear arsenal scheduled to be completed in December, 2001.

S 2549: National Defense Authorization Act for Fiscal Year 2001

Vote on an amendment that would allow the president to make further arms reductions only after the Defense Department submits its quadrenniel defense review and an overall report on the status of the U.S. nuclear arsenal scheduled to be completed in December, 2001. The measure replaced language in an underlying amendment that would have waived a provision of the fiscal 1998 defense authorization law that would have given the President the authority to dismantle nuclear weapons below the 6,000 warhead level set in the first Strategic Arms Reduction Treaty [START I] with Russia.
(Amendment sponsored by Warner, R-VA; Underlying amendment sponsored Kerrey, D-NE; Bill sponsored by Warner, R-VA)
Amendment adopted 51-47: R 50-3; D 1-44 on 06/07/2000.

Senator John Forbes Kerry voted NO.

----------------------------------------------------------------

Anti-Terrorism Authority-Passage

Bill Number: HR 3162
Issue: National Security Issues
Date: 10/25/2001
Sponsor: Bill sponsored by Sensenbrenner R-WI
Roll Call Number: 0313
Passed
Full Member List

Vote to pass a bill that would expand law enforcement's power to investigate suspected terrorists.

HR 3162 Uniting and Strengthening America by Providing Appropriate Tools Required to Intercept and Obstruct Terrorism (USA PATRIOT) Act of 2001

Vote to pass a bill that would expand law enforcement's power to investigate suspected terrorists. The bill would allow disclosure of wiretap information among certain government officials, authorize limited disclosure of secret grand jury information to certain government officials, and authorize the attorney general to detain foreigners he suspects are tied to terrorism. It also would make it easier for law enforcement to track voice and Internet communications using surveillance techniques and would strengthen laws to combat money laundering. Most of the bill's intelligence-gathering provisions would sunset after four years.
(Bill sponsored by Sensenbrenner R-WI)
Bill passed (thus cleared for the president) 98-1: R 49-0; D 48-1; I 1-0 on 10/25/2001.

Bill Number: HR 3162-107th Congress (2001-2002)
House Passage Vote: 10/24/2001-Outcome:Passed
Senate Passage Vote: 10/25/2001-Outcome:Passed
Presidential Action: 10/26/2001-Outcome:Passed

Senator John Forbes Kerry voted YES.

----------------------------------------------------------------

Terrorist Attacks-Passage

Bill Number: SJRES 22
Issue: National Security Issues
Date: 09/12/2001
Sponsor: Resolution sponsored by Daschle, S-SD
Roll Call Number: 277
Joint Resolution passed
Full Member List

Vote to pass a joint resolution that would express the sense of Congress that the Senate and the House condemn the terrorists who planned and carried out the September 11, 2001, attacks against the United States, as well as their sponsors.

SJRES 22 Terrorist Attacks Condemnation

Vote to pass a joint resolution that would express the sense of Congress that the Senate and the House condemn the terrorists who planned and carried out the September 11, 2001, attacks against the United States, as well as their sponsors. The resolution would also extend deepest condolences to the victims and their families, commend the heroic action of rescue workers, volunteers and officials responding to the scene, commit support of increased resources to eradicate terrorism, and declare September 12, 2001, as a nation day of unity and mourning.
(Resolution sponsored by Daschle, S-SD)
Joint Resolution passed 100-0: R 49-0; D 50-0; I 1-0 on 09/12/2001.

Bill Number: SJ Res 22-107th Congress (2001-2002)
Senate Passage Vote:09/12/2001-Outcome:Passed
House Passage Vote: 09/13/2001-Outcome:Passed
Presidential Action: Signed on 09/18/2001

Senator John Forbes Kerry voted YES.

For further status information, go to where I found these statistics. It’s not a right or left wing organization, it’s just facts: http://www.vote-smart.org/index.htm

Oh, one more thing while we’re here, Kerry IS ranked as the most liberal senator. Know how he got that title? My guess is you probably don’t. If you read up on that, instead of just regurgitating media rhetoric, you’ll see that he is only ranked that was because he has been absent from many votes during the past year…and I challenge any of you to work your day job and run for president at the same time.

-The list goes on and on, Smurph my lad….my point is, you’re fighting on the wrong team. Wake-up and vote strong, or your rights will be taken away and your children will have to work until they’re 80 before they can retire.

"A popular government, without popular information, or the means of acquiring it, is but a prologue to a farce or a tragedy... a people who mean to be their own governors must arm themselves with the power which knowledge gives."
—James Madison, Author of the U.S Constitution and 4th President of the United States

0WN04 – vote strong

For those of you who have more than half a brain, DKONG is pulling his wanna-be facts straight from the Republican Party's website...another “true-believer” fooled by the spin-mongers. Smurphie, my friend, you aughta get out more…or maybe you should just read more and stop watching Fox News and skimming Sinclair media propaganda.

-Wake-up, DKONG my lad. Bush and his fellow neo-cons are ruining this once proud nation of ours. They are condemning the environment, ruining the social security system, disassembling the public education system in favor of landslide tax shelters for huge corporations, giving away your retirement benefits and calling it a “tax return” and you swallow it hook, line and sinker. They lie to you, they cheat you of your own money, they sell your children’s future, they wreck your retirement funds, they sell your job to the Indians and the Chinese, they pollute your swimming holes, they send your children and your friend’s children off to fight and die in an unnecessary war, they shirked their own military duty and bold-face lie about it, they ignore and depose furthering scientific research that could cure you or your loved-ones of a life-threatening injury or disease….and still you support them. You are the exact reason I will never vote for a candidate like your "fearless" leader. If there was a foundation for the curing of chronic socio-political, anti-progressive, neo-idyllic stupidity, I’d recommend you commit yourself.

Zeig Heil BUSH, you jackass.

What bullshit.

The subject of John Kerry's military service and why he wouldn't make a good military president has been a topic for debate during this election. The thing I can't understand is how anyone who has NOT been in the military, or served in combat, can say that they are more prepared to lead during a war, or war-like crisis, than someone who has seen war from the front lines.

George Bush not only shirked his duty in the "safe" National Guard during Vietnam, but he doesn't have the sack to come out and admit it. Instead, he bashes Kerry, who, not only went to war by choice, but also led from the front. Who is really the capable wartime president? Who is really better prepared to deal with conflict resolution? The pampered, C-D student, cheerleader, failed-businessman, AWOL, wanna-be Texan-but-actually-from-New-England who was not even elected to his current office? Or, the pampered yet intelligent, decorated Vietnam vet, experienced 20+yr. ELECTED public servant? You, of course, can choose your own cadidate, but don't try to tell me who is the more capable...the choice is obvious.

So, which party really has the most real experience protecting our country? Certainly not the brain-trust neo-con's who brought us the Iraq debacle! Let's just put our cards on the table, shall we?

Here are some actual facts for ya, DKONG old pal:

Democrats:

* John Kerry: Lt., Navy 1966-70; Silver Star, Bronze Star with Combat V,
Purple Hearts.
* Richard Gephardt: Air National Guard, 1965-71.
* David Bonior: Staff Sgt., Air Force 1968-72.
* Tom Daschle: 1st Lt., Air Force SAC 1969-72.
* Al Gore: enlisted Aug. 1969; sent to Vietnam Jan. 1971 as an army
journalist in 20th Engineer Brigade.
* Bob Kerrey: Lt. j.g. Navy 1966-69; Medal of Honor, Vietnam.
* Daniel Inouye: Army 1943-47; Medal of Honor, WWII.
* Charles Rangel: Staff Sgt., Army 1948-52; Bronze Star, Korea.
* Max Cleland: Captain, Army 1965-68; Silver Star & Bronze Star, Vietnam.
* Ted Kennedy: Army, 1951-53.
* Tom Harkin: Lt., Navy, 1962-67; Naval Reserve, 1968-74.
* Jack Reed: Army Ranger, 1971-1979; Captain, Army Reserve 1979-91.
* Fritz Hollings: Army officer in WWII; Bronze Star and seven campaign
ribbons.
* Leonard Boswell: Lt. Col., Army 1956-76; Vietnam, DFCs, Bronze Stars, and
Soldier's Medal.
* Pete Peterson: Air Force Captain, POW. Purple Heart, Silver Star and
Legion of Merit.
* Mike Thompson: Staff sergeant, 173rd Airborne, Purple Heart.
* Bill McBride: Candidate for Fla. Governor. Marine in Vietnam; Bronze Star
with Combat V.
* Gray Davis: Army Captain in Vietnam, Bronze Star.
* Pete Stark: Air Force 1955-57
* Chuck Robb: Vietnam
* Howell Heflin: Silver Star
* George McGovern: Silver Star & DFC during WWII.
* Bill Clinton: Did not serve. Student deferments. Entered draft but
received #311.
* Jimmy Carter: Seven years in the Navy.
* Walter Mondale: Army 1951-1953
* John Glenn: WWII and Korea; six DFCs and Air Medal with 18 Clusters.
* Tom Lantos: Served in Hungarian underground in WWII. Saved by Raoul
Wallenberg.

26 out of 27 listed here served; of those 26, 18 saw combat; of those 18, 14 were highly decorated.

Republicans -- these are the guys sending people to war:

* George W. Bush: failed to complete his six-year National Guard; got
re-assigned to Alabama so he could campaign for family friend running for U.S.
Senate; failed to show up for required medical exam, disappeared from duty.
* Dick Cheney: did not serve. Several deferments.
* John Ashcroft: did not serve. Seven deferments.
* Don Rumsfeld: served in Navy (1954-57) as flight instructor.
* Dennis Hastert: did not serve.
* Tom Delay: did not serve.
* Roy Blunt: did not serve.
* Bill Frist: did not serve.
* Mitch McConnell: did not serve.
* Rick Santorum: did not serve.
* Trent Lott: did not serve.
* Jeb Bush: did not serve.
* Karl Rove: did not serve.
* Saxby Chambliss: did not serve. The man who attacked Max Cleland's patriotism.
* Paul Wolfowitz: did not serve.
* Vin Weber: did not serve.
* Richard Perle: did not serve.
* Douglas Feith: did not serve.
* Eliot Abrams: did not serve.
* Richard Shelby: did not serve.
* Jon Kyl: did not serve.
* Tim Hutchison: did not serve.
* Christopher Cox: did not serve.
* Newt Gingrich: did not serve.
* Ronald Reagan: did not serve.
* Bob Dornan: Consciously enlisted after fighting was over in Korea.
* Phil Gramm: did not serve.
* John McCain: Silver Star, Bronze Star, Legion of Merit, Purple Heart and
Distinguished Flying Cross.
* Dana Rohrabacher: did not serve.
* John M. McHugh: did not serve.
* JC Watts: did not serve.
* Jack Kemp: did not serve. "Knee problem," although continued in NFL for 8
years.
* Dan Quayle: Journalism unit of the Indiana National Guard.
* Rudy Giuliani: did not serve.
* George Pataki: did not serve.
* Spencer Abraham: did not serve.
* John Engler: did not serve.
* Lindsey Graham: National Guard lawyer.
* Arnold Schwarzenegger: AWOL from Austrian army base.

7 out of 39 listed served; of those 7, 1 was actually in combat. The others served cushy, non-threatening roles. Two of those, including "President" Bush, went AWOL from their duties and did not return. That makes 32 out of 39 that did NOT serve.

Pundits & Preachers
* Sean Hannity: did not serve.
* Rush Limbaugh: did not serve (like he had a pair to begin with?)
* Bill O'Reilly: did not serve.
* Michael Savage: did not serve.
* George Will: did not serve.
* Chris Matthews: did not serve.
* Paul Gigot: did not serve.
* Bill Bennett: did not serve.
* Pat Buchanan: did not serve.
* John Wayne: did not serve.
* Bill Kristol: did not serve.
* Kenneth Starr: did not serve.
* Antonin Scalia: did not serve.
* Clarence Thomas: did not serve.
* Ralph Reed: did not serve.
* Michael Medved: did not serve.
* Charlie Daniels: did not serve.
* Ted Nugent: did not serve.

Umm...none of these guys ponied-up.

Democrats and Republican - notice a pattern here?

Here are some more fun facts for ya, KONG old pal:

FY 1999 Defense Authorization - Passage

Bill Number: S 2057
Issue: Military Issues
Date: 06/25/1998
Sponsor: Bill introduced by Thurmond, R-SC.
Roll Call Number: 0181
Bill passed
Full Member List

Vote to pass a bill authorizing $274 billion for military construction, military activities of the Defense Department, and defense activities of the Energy Department.

S 2057: National Defense Authorization Act for Fiscal Year 1999

Vote to pass a bill authorizing $274 billion for military construction, military activities of the Defense Department, and defense activities of the Energy Department. Among other provisions, the bill includes $1.9 billion to continue operations in Bosnia, makes it more difficult for the administration to close military bases without Congressional approval, authorizes a 3.6 percent military pay raise, and authorizes the President to waive a one-year moratorium on the use of anti-personnel landmines.
Bill introduced by Thurmond, R-SC.
(Bill passed 88-4 on 6/25/98)

Bill Status:
Bill Number: S 2057 - 105th Congress (1997-98)
Senate Passage Vote: 06/25/98 - Outcome: Passed
No further action was taken on this bill, never became law. HR 3616 passed instead.

Bill Status:
Bill Number: HR 3616 - 105th Congress (1997-98)
House Passage Vote: 05/21/98 - Outcome: Passed
Senate Passage Vote: 06/25/98 - Outcome: Passed
House Conference Report Vote: 09/24/98 - Outcome: Passed
Senate Conference Report Vote: 10/01/98 - Outcome: Passed
Presidential Action: Signed on 10/17/98
Public Law Number: 105-261 112 Stat. 1920

Senator John Forbes Kerry voted YES.

----------------------------------------------------------------

Military Pay Increase - Passage

Bill Number: S 4
Issue: Military Issues
Date: 02/24/1999
Sponsor: Bill introduced by Warner, R-VA.
Roll Call Number: 0026
Bill passed
Full Member List

Vote to authorize a military pay raise of 4.8 percent in 2000 and annual pay increases through 2006.

S 4: Soldiers', Sailors', Airmen's, and Marines' Bill of Rights Act of 1999

Vote to pass a bill to authorize a military pay raise of 4.8 percent in 2000 and annual pay increases through 2006 of 0.5 percent above the inflation rate. The bill would also provide additional incentives to certain enlisted personnel who remain on active duty for an additional year, provide additional pension options and benefits, and establish a $180 per month allowance for members eligible for food stamps, among other provisions.
Bill introduced by Warner, R-VA.
(Bill passed 91-8 on 2/24/99)

Bill Status: (As of 12/08/1999)
Bill Number: S 4 - 106th Congress (1999-2000)
House Passage Vote: - Outcome:
Senate Passage Vote: 02/24/1999 - Outcome: Passed
Measure returned to the Senate by the House on 11/18/99

Senator John Forbes Kerry voted YES.

----------------------------------------------------------------

FY 1999 Defense Authorization - Veterans' Health Care

Bill Number: S 2057
Issue: Veterans Issues
Date: 06/25/1998
Sponsor: Amendment introduced by Harkin, D-IA; bill introduced by Thurmond, R-SC.
Roll Call Number: 0175
Amendment rejected
Full Member List

Vote on an amendment to transfer $329 million from the Defense Department to the Veterans Affairs Department for veterans health care programs.

S 2057: National Defense Authorization Act for Fiscal Year 1999

Vote on an amendment to transfer $329 million from the Defense Department to the Veterans Affairs Department for veterans health care programs. The transfer would be conducted by the Secretary of Defense in a manner which 'causes the least significant harm' to military readiness and to military personnel's quality of life.
Amendment introduced by Harkin, D-IA; bill introduced by Thurmond, R-SC.
(Amendment rejected 38-55 on 6/25/98)

Bill Status:
Bill Number: S 2057 - 105th Congress (1997-98)
Senate Passage Vote: 06/25/98 - Outcome: Passed
No further action was taken on this bill, never became law. HR 3616 passed instead.

Bill Status:
Bill Number: HR 3616 - 105th Congress (1997-98)
House Passage Vote: 05/21/98 - Outcome: Passed
Senate Passage Vote: 06/25/98 - Outcome: Passed
House Conference Report Vote: 09/24/98 - Outcome: Passed
Senate Conference Report Vote: 10/01/98 - Outcome: Passed
Presidential Action: Signed on 10/17/98
Public Law Number: 105-261 112 Stat. 1920

Senator John Forbes Kerry voted YES.

----------------------------------------------------------------

FY 2001 Defense Auth.-Military Retiree Health Benefits

Bill Number: S 2549
Issue: Military Issues
Date: 06/07/2000
Sponsor: Motion sponsored by Johnson, D-SD, Point of order sponsored by Gramm, R-TX, Amendment sponsored by Johnson, D-SD, Bill sponsored by Warner, R-VA
Roll Call Number: 0118
Motion rejected
Full Member List

Vote to waive a procedural motion that would have killed an amendment that would extend eligibility to the Federal Employees Health Benefits Program to military retirees who joined the services before June 7, 1956.

S 2549: National Defense Authorization Act for Fiscal Year 2001

Vote to waive a procedural motion that would have killed an amendment that would extend eligibility to the Federal Employees Health Benefits Program to military retirees who joined the services before June 7, 1956. The federal government would pay for the full cost of enrollment, which would cost an estimated $92 billion over 10 years. Military retirees who joined the services after June 7, 1956 would be eligible to enroll in the program, but would have to pay the same fees as federal employees.
(Motion sponsored by Johnson, D-SD, Point of order sponsored by Gramm, R-TX, Amendment sponsored by Johnson, D-SD, Bill sponsored by Warner, R-VA)
Motion rejected 54-46: R 17-36; D 35-10 on 06/07/2000.

Senator John Forbes Kerry voted YES.

----------------------------------------------------------------

FY 2001 Defense Authorization-Nuclear Weapons Systems

Bill Number: S 2549
Issue: Military Issues
Date: 06/07/2000
Sponsor: Amendment sponsored by Warner, R-VA; Underlying amendment sponsored Kerrey, D-NE; Bill sponsored by Warner, R-VA
Roll Call Number: 0119
Amendment adopted
Full Member List

Vote on an amendment that would allow the president to make further arms reductions only after the Defense Department submits its quadrenniel defense review and an overall report on the status of the U.S. nuclear arsenal scheduled to be completed in December, 2001.

S 2549: National Defense Authorization Act for Fiscal Year 2001

Vote on an amendment that would allow the president to make further arms reductions only after the Defense Department submits its quadrenniel defense review and an overall report on the status of the U.S. nuclear arsenal scheduled to be completed in December, 2001. The measure replaced language in an underlying amendment that would have waived a provision of the fiscal 1998 defense authorization law that would have given the President the authority to dismantle nuclear weapons below the 6,000 warhead level set in the first Strategic Arms Reduction Treaty [START I] with Russia.
(Amendment sponsored by Warner, R-VA; Underlying amendment sponsored Kerrey, D-NE; Bill sponsored by Warner, R-VA)
Amendment adopted 51-47: R 50-3; D 1-44 on 06/07/2000.

Senator John Forbes Kerry voted NO.

----------------------------------------------------------------

Anti-Terrorism Authority-Passage

Bill Number: HR 3162
Issue: National Security Issues
Date: 10/25/2001
Sponsor: Bill sponsored by Sensenbrenner R-WI
Roll Call Number: 0313
Passed
Full Member List

Vote to pass a bill that would expand law enforcement's power to investigate suspected terrorists.

HR 3162 Uniting and Strengthening America by Providing Appropriate Tools Required to Intercept and Obstruct Terrorism (USA PATRIOT) Act of 2001

Vote to pass a bill that would expand law enforcement's power to investigate suspected terrorists. The bill would allow disclosure of wiretap information among certain government officials, authorize limited disclosure of secret grand jury information to certain government officials, and authorize the attorney general to detain foreigners he suspects are tied to terrorism. It also would make it easier for law enforcement to track voice and Internet communications using surveillance techniques and would strengthen laws to combat money laundering. Most of the bill's intelligence-gathering provisions would sunset after four years.
(Bill sponsored by Sensenbrenner R-WI)
Bill passed (thus cleared for the president) 98-1: R 49-0; D 48-1; I 1-0 on 10/25/2001.

Bill Number: HR 3162-107th Congress (2001-2002)
House Passage Vote: 10/24/2001-Outcome:Passed
Senate Passage Vote: 10/25/2001-Outcome:Passed
Presidential Action: 10/26/2001-Outcome:Passed

Senator John Forbes Kerry voted YES.

----------------------------------------------------------------

Terrorist Attacks-Passage

Bill Number: SJRES 22
Issue: National Security Issues
Date: 09/12/2001
Sponsor: Resolution sponsored by Daschle, S-SD
Roll Call Number: 277
Joint Resolution passed
Full Member List

Vote to pass a joint resolution that would express the sense of Congress that the Senate and the House condemn the terrorists who planned and carried out the September 11, 2001, attacks against the United States, as well as their sponsors.

SJRES 22 Terrorist Attacks Condemnation

Vote to pass a joint resolution that would express the sense of Congress that the Senate and the House condemn the terrorists who planned and carried out the September 11, 2001, attacks against the United States, as well as their sponsors. The resolution would also extend deepest condolences to the victims and their families, commend the heroic action of rescue workers, volunteers and officials responding to the scene, commit support of increased resources to eradicate terrorism, and declare September 12, 2001, as a nation day of unity and mourning.
(Resolution sponsored by Daschle, S-SD)
Joint Resolution passed 100-0: R 49-0; D 50-0; I 1-0 on 09/12/2001.

Bill Number: SJ Res 22-107th Congress (2001-2002)
Senate Passage Vote:09/12/2001-Outcome:Passed
House Passage Vote: 09/13/2001-Outcome:Passed
Presidential Action: Signed on 09/18/2001

Senator John Forbes Kerry voted YES.

For further status information, go to where I found these statistics. It’s not a right or left wing organization, it’s just facts: http://www.vote-smart.org/index.htm

Oh, one more thing while we’re here, Kerry IS ranked as the most liberal senator. Know how he got that title? My guess is you probably don’t. If you read up on that, instead of just regurgitating media rhetoric, you’ll see that he is only ranked that was because he has been absent from many votes during the past year…and I challenge any of you to work your day job and run for president at the same time.

-The list goes on and on, DKONG my lad…my point is, you’re fighting on the wrong team. Wake-up and vote strong, or your rights will be taken away and your children will have to work until they’re 80 before they can retire.

"A popular government, without popular information, or the means of acquiring it, is but a prologue to a farce or a tragedy... a people who mean to be their own governors must arm themselves with the power which knowledge gives."
—James Madison, Author of the U.S Constitution and 4th President of the United States

0WN04 – vote strong

I invite everyone interested in erudite political comments and correct information to read the November 1, 2004 NEW YORKER. The first article in this issue is by "The Editors,"; and if it doesn't make you think twice about George W. Bush and decide to NOTE VOTE for Bush, I suggest you get your head examined! Bush is definitely trying to ruin the country--either consciously or unconsciously. He is frightening.

nice set of facts ya got there. Too bad that all you could find was a very small handfull of things that Kerry actually voted on in support of the military. You'd think in a 20 year time period in congress that there would be more, wouldn't you? Indeed, a few of the votes that you listed were taken shortly after 9/11, when it would be political suicide to do otherwise and while Kerry may be a total moron, he's not that stupid.

Here's a question for ya - try explaining why then, with all of John Kerry's stellar military career that the military supports Bush over 3 to 1? Why is it that Kerry has yet to visit any military bases in the ongoing campaign?? Why is it that more than 90% of the people that served with Kerry in Vietnam say he's a slimeball and stayed in country only long enough to collect enough film to run for President some day?

You know the democrat party is in trouble when they have to pretend they are pro military. Too bad the past 40 years of Democrat politics don't back that up.

You crack me up. Are you like the leftist poster child, or what? Love this rant:

"They are condemning the environment, ruining the social security system, disassembling the public education system in favor of landslide tax shelters for huge corporations,.... You are the exact reason I will never vote for a candidate like your "fearless" leader."

Dude, have you ever left the 60's?? I mean, go smoke a bong or something and calm down.

How many times have you watched Fatty Moore's propaganda, sounds like you've got it memorized.

See you at the polls on Tuesday, try not to take that as I'm attempting to intimidate you or anything like that.

Quoting:" -ranked #1 most liberal senator in the U.S. Senate
-voted the most times out of the entire senate to cut defense and intelligence spending
-voted the most times to increase taxes
-he claims he is a catholic, while he has voted numerous times to increase abortion rights
-he supported the iraq war, voted for it:
"Saddaam is a threat and needs to be disarmed."
"You are a fool if you believe Saddam doesnt need to be disarmed."
then he voted against funding the troops, saying:
"The President failed to fund our troops in Iraq."
actually your richness, YOU failed to support our troops in Iraq."
----------------------------------------------------

Haha wow did you go to Bush's site to copy and past that info?

Let me take em one at a time:
-ranked #1 most liberal senator in the U.S. Senate: This was one study which was manipulated completely to make him look extremely liberal. It did not span his whole career... it actually only took a very small time period into account to find its "statistics"

-voted the most times out of the entire senate to cut defense and intelligence spending: I love this wonderfully flawed wording. For these "facts" they also counted voting against a raise of funds as "cutting" and even if proposing a funding raise lower than another one on the table (happens often) they still counted the vote under "cutting". Skewing facts beyond recognition is no better than a straight up lie in my book... I guess the people that are pro-Bush dont agree with me.

-he claims he is a catholic, while he has voted numerous times to increase abortion rights: Well I'm happy for this seperation of Church and state... I'm also happy for such an elitist stance on religion. You can't be christian if you aren't completely against abortion? I didn't get this memo. I guess Cheney can't be christian because he doesn't shun his gay daughter now too? What nonsense.

-he supported the iraq war, voted for it:
"Saddaam is a threat and needs to be disarmed."
"You are a fool if you believe Saddam doesnt need to be disarmed.": Wait... where in those quotes does it say he is for the war? I didn't know war was the only way to solve any conflict nowadays. Are peaceful solutions to "french" for you?

-then he voted against funding the troops, saying:
"The President failed to fund our troops in Iraq."
actually your richness, YOU failed to support our troops in Iraq.": Actually he didn't vote against funding the troops, he voted against the 80 billion dollar blank check Bush wanted. Less than 30 billion was actually specified for the troops. Yet this isnt true either: He said he would have supported the bill if they would get rid of some of the many tax cuts bush has handed out to the top 1% of earners as a means to fund the bill since he, unlike bush, is responsible enough economically to want to actually fund spending instead of building up the deficit.

I guess they don't tell you that part on Fox News?

i'm a liberal democrat but i think kerry was the most disgustingly awful candidate the dems have produced in my lifetime.
as for bush, i've always been suspicious about his SAT scores, college grades and IQ scores