I'm no Russophile, Chechnya has been dealt a bad hand for generations, and I feel justified that I'm not a "root causes" guy in aruging that the Russians *have* made it worse by their horrific actions in their recent wars.

All that said-- I hope they kill every last one of these madmen. This is not war, this is not "collateral damage," it's barbarism of a shade that would have made Uncle Joe Stalin proud.

Ugh. We've got to win this war, or else it will spread out of control and consume the civilized world.

BTW, Ace-- you can write "Chechen" instead of "Chechnyen." While both mean the same thing, you can save yourself a couple of letters, and I know much you hate a lot of loose shit going on.

Cheers,
Dave
Arlington, Virginia

Is there a rope donation link yet?

There are other parts of Russia that have gotten just as raw a deal as Chechnya, but you don't hear about them slaughtering civilians on a regular basis.

I've said in these comments, other comments, and my blog: CCW. Learn to shoot, and shoot well.

It looks like some Russians want to fight the terrorists 'American' style.

Raoul:

Like I said, I'm not a "root causes" guy. I made the comment in understanding, not sympathy. I do believe that the biggest influence here *is* Islamic fundamentalism, and that without its presence, these events would almost certainly not have happened.

Having your country brutally crushed by your enemy leaves you with little love for them. Grozny, 1994 (and Grozny, 1999) was bitchslapped in a terrible way. Had Americans done in Iraq even one tenth of the things the Russians did in Chechnya, MoveOn.org would be fully justified in calling for Dubya's impeachment. Civil wars are not civil, and the Russians don't do Just Wars.

So, what I think is that the brutality of the Russian campaigns in the Caucusus "prepared the battlefield" for Chechen radicalization. Al Qaeda and their friends were only too happy to step in and counsel a receptive audience. Would Chechens resort to murderous terrorism against innocents had Russia fought a "gentler, kinder" war against them? Who knows, it's possible. The Irish were treated with flowers in comparison, and some wackos there still feel terrorism was justified. It is obvious, however, that some Chechens themselves feel fully justified in executing a blood war to the death against all Russians, and the consequences of their desire for revenge was proven in the absolutely horrifice events this week.

Some cultures know how to lose well. Chechnya doesn't. Russia must discover a way to deal with that fact.

Dave
Arlington, Virginia

It's a breaking point in another way as well. Glenn takes a swipe at Willis. Not a swipe of the magnitude of Zell-duelling-Matthews or Bob-Dole's-cock-to-John-Kerry's-forehead, but still. It seems your dreams may soon be realized.

The whole platic explosive in female passengers' hoo-ha's still has me freaked out. What the fuck do you do about that? Cancel the airline industry?

Clark,

I think you're sitting on rim, so to speak, of an entier new realm of really tasteless puns about the females passengers hiding plastique in ther "hoo-ha's"

Exploding vaginas?

Damn, and here I thought I was past worrying about the consequences of burning genitalia, so far after college.

The terrorists have surely won.

Cheers,
Dave
Arlington, Virginia

Good news,

the daughter, Alana, survived.

See front page of
http://www.latimes.com/

Since won't let me post the whole link

Chechens appear to be logic impaired. Russia in general has a long history of mass slaughter, often just for kicks. How much worse can it become when you given such people real motivation to see you wiped out?

Unfortunately we have already become barbaric. We have legitimized murder in the womb by people who are supposed to heal. Until we stop abortion, evil will continue to seek out we Americans. We have lost our moral high ground!

Ace, that was very gripping account of what we face as humans against monsters. Once a group loses its humanity (as Putin may be doing at this point) then we have no where to go but down. And while I loathe the thought of anyone being cruelly put to death, this lastest incident proves that there is not reasoning with the unreasonably insane.

Terrorists? Islamists? Jihadis? Call them what they are - Michael Moore's Minute Men.

'Unfortunately we have already become barbaric. We have legitimized murder in the womb by people who are supposed to heal. Until we stop abortion, evil will continue to seek out we Americans. We have lost our moral high ground'--Rich V.

OK.Usually I can get behind the old'the enemy of my enemy is my friend'bit, but I find this statement offensive in the extreme.Was it not Falwell who blamed 9/11 on 'moral flaws' in the US?
The less said along this particular line the better.We are targetted by the Islamic scum BECAUSE of their ignorant,backward,religious,fanaticism.We are not targetted because of what we are not but because of what they are.
Sorry but I have no use for reasoning like this.NO USE AT ALL.

Did we have nowhere to go but down when we fire-bombed Tokyo? Are you kidding? Should the Russians hold hands and sing koom by ya in response to this? Chechnya needs to pay for either outwardly or worse silently supporting terrorism. We held Germanys responsible for what they had done in the 30s and 40s why can’t we hold Chechnya responsible for this? Or for that matter Islamists since 9 out of 20 were arab muslims?

Part of what al-Qaeda may be shooting for is an unrestrained response from Russia that can bring the condemnation of the UN and France. And that should make you ask why would the UN and France do nothing for Russia in response to this gut wrenching attack but immediately condemn Russia's response? I'll bet that is exactly how this plays out. Oh Kofi will say how sad he is over the whole deal, he feels for the children, but what will he actually do? He will do everything in his power to restrain Russia from taking corrective action and that is fucked up.

I hate being right... That happened faster than I thought.

James-- excellent point. Of course, as I highlighted previously, the Chechens don't lose well. Neither did Japan or Germany, but when they lost, at least they lost.

Warfare has changed a lot in the last sixty years, and America is no longer willing to countenance the deliberate killing of civilians. To those who say "well, you did it before, so you're being hypocritical in not remaining immoral" is a silly argument. Portions of humanity once thought tearing out peasant hearts in honor of their gods was a good idea, too. We learned, and we changed. I won't argue that how we fight wars today is any better-- the desire to finish it all off with the cold steel is seductive. But that's the fact, jack, and the Chechens have to live by those rules, just as the Russians do, or face condemnation from people like Kofi Annan.

If I were the Russians in 1991, I would have let Chechnya go. If I'm the Russians in 2004, I'm deporting them all to Siberia, and sowing their fields with salt. No killing, no murder-- just the end of Chechnya as a political and cultural entity.

They bought their tickets, they knew what they were getting into. I say, let 'em crash.

Cheers,
Dave
Arlington, Virginia

Ace,

Your comments put me in mind of the forward of "The Soul of Battle" (I think it was that one, although it might have been "Carnage and Culture" and I'm too lazy to go look it up) by Victor Davis Hanson. He discusses the transformation of his uncle from peaceful farmer to a man capable of firebombing Tokyo. His points were twofold.

1) It is not so much our methods that separate us from totalitarians of all stripes. In battle, we can be as viscous as anyone. In fact, we still hold the all-time record. What separates us is WHY we fight. As long as we hold on to that, there will be hope for us, and for humanity.

2) Don't fuck with the United States of America. (he didn't actually say that, but it was the subtext).